Need other people's thoughts.

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You don't know the history with him so I understand. Trust me, using parts that are OK with 98% of the 3800 world, will not work with him.

Gotcha. I feel like I fit into that category nicely myself though, lol. This is going to be another rambling post from me, but I think it's worth digging into a little.

For what it's worth, of the 3 engines I have destroyed over the last 4 years (spread across two cars), they all self-destructed at literally the exact same spot under similar acceleration conditions. The engines were on drastically different setups, at drastically different power levels, but all blew at similar RPMs and throttle position. It strikes me as more than coincidental that the OP said it happened at WOT around 90mph. That is the top of 2nd on a PAU (5500rpm is 91.5 mph), which is exactly where all my failures have been. I will elaborate:

The first engine I blew up was the stock L67 in my 98 Park Avenue Ultra. At that point, I had the M90 pretty well maxxed out and up to that point had experienced zero problems with the car. It was on straight methanol with intercooling, M90 with 2.55" pulley and overdrive crank, etc. I was running stupid amounts of timing advance at the time because methanol doesn't really tell you when to stop (you'll pretty much pre-ignite before you knock). I was doing my usual pull onto the highway on the way home from work, when all of a sudden near the top of 2nd gear, BOOM. My #2 rod vanished. Big end intact, piston intact above the wrist pin, rod through the block. I was logging at the time and experienced zero knock and no unusual AFRs or anything that would point at any particular cause. I assume the fact that I was running like 40 degrees of timing advance probably just resulted in too much cylinder pressure for the rod to handle. That was early in my tuning experience and my first experience with methanol. Live and learn.

The second was the stock L67 in my 1998 Regal. Same highway ramp, same type of acceleration, same type of boost level (this was right after slapping the M122 on), but it wasn't making good power like the tapped out M90 did, don't know why. Same story, it started making a racket just over 5,000rpms at the top of 2nd. This time, however, it ate a bearing and started knocking. That car had well over 220k on the engine and I know for a fact it was not well cared for. It had been in our Buy-here-pay-here fleet for at least 5 years, so had been out collecting hard miles from low-rent customers with few oil changes or other maintenance. I attribute that one to long-term poor maintenance and bearings that were too loose/about to go anyway, but it's interesting that it happened under the same circumstances.

The third time was the L26 bottom end on my 1998 Park Avenue in twincharged configuration. Same story...it was maybe the second or third time I had actually gone wide open throttle on the setup, and I had just turned the boost up some more. I'll be damned if it didn't blow within 50 feet of my other two disasters...again, at the top of 2nd gear at WOT. I still haven't torn that down to see what the cause is, but it still had oil pressure so I'm assuming it's like the first engine and my big end will be intact, my block will have a window, etc.

I have become convinced there is something magical about that RPM range under WOT that is contributing to these failures. Whether it's something in the tune, or something physically in the engines that doesn't like that rev range. Only one of the failures appears to be lubrication related, the other two appear to be (I'll have to confirm with this latest failure) rod or wrist pin failure.

All these engines still had balance shafts, so I don't know whether that could be an issue at higher RPMs. The timing advance was drastically different, I was actually considerably less than stock advance even on my last failure (hadn't even started turning the timing up or leaning fuel yet). The AFRs were drastically different. The only thing all these failures have in common is the RPM and engine loading conditions. Basically, going uphill at the top of 2nd at WOT.

I think we can all agree that the OP didn't blow this engine up due to excessive power, so it might be worth digging into what the weakness of these engines might be under those conditions. Granted, he had a canned tune that may have contributed, but my engines blew with varying states of tune. The first being super aggressive, the second more or less stock, the third super conservative...the only one that showed any knock was the stock tune on the regal and even it didn't knock with water/meth.

I don't know what the point of this post is other than to share my experiences and see if anyone has any ideas about what the common cause might be.
 

slowchevy

eat ass drive fast
Sep 10, 2007
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Guy in front of me was running his window washers and I just got done detailing the car that morning. Rage passed him and as it went to go into third I heard a bang and it literally quit, from 6000rpm to zero. Sounds like we've had similar experiences.

This is why I'm partial to the idea of going back to stock. I just don't wanna deal with this, but at the same time the smile it puts on my face hearing people interested at car shows and the questions I get asked really made me feel good about it being a different kinda car.
[MENTION=79]bikrboy128[/MENTION] I've already considered turbo, it's just like I said. Scared of what I don't personally know.
 

Lord Tin Foilhat

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That's why you learn. Pick up a damn book then you won't be "scared"/

Modding will always have risk. The goal is to do supporting mods and monitoring devices first before you start throwing more power at it...that way you reduce the possibility of breaking something by knowing something is wrong before its to late.
 

ktraver97ss

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Aug 29, 2007
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Turbo on the bonne was about the same amount of work as headers on the camaro. lol I've had it on 2 years and no issues once we got it going, tuned safe as fuck James style tho. I drive it everyday and to wi all summer and wouldnt think twice driving it across the country.

It doesnt seem like you have any rush, just start shopping for used parts and read as much as you can.
 

slowchevy

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Curious what a turbo 3800 drives like. What would really push me is to be able to check someone's car out and see what I feel while driving it. Anyone wanna give me five to ten minutes of seat time with their turbo v6? :s00ls:

From there it would really be having people to help me where I get hung up. Aka everywhere. I know how a turbo works but after that, zero idea if anything.
 
Curious what a turbo 3800 drives like. What would really push me is to be able to check someone's car out and see what I feel while driving it. Anyone wanna give me five to ten minutes of seat time with their turbo v6? :s00ls:

From there it would really be having people to help me where I get hung up. Aka everywhere. I know how a turbo works but after that, zero idea if anything.

Come to Wichita...I'll let you try and blow up my car in turbo only mode when I get it back together.
 

Lord Tin Foilhat

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Turbo on the bonne was about the same amount of work as headers on the camaro. lol I've had it on 2 years and no issues once we got it going, tuned safe as fuck James style tho. I drive it everyday and to wi all summer and wouldnt think twice driving it across the country.

It doesnt seem like you have any rush, just start shopping for used parts and read as much as you can.

I think my next dd will be a turbo 3800. Stupid cheap and stupid easy to make power with a cheapo turbo and fairly reliable. Just wish there was manual trannys in them. (Other then the camaro v6)
 

Angus

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The Daytona was a blast.

Problem is the chain in the trans and you need to go 1" for it to reliable power. I think if you went turbo, you'd come across this issue real quick with the additional weight of a PA being flung around.
 

slowchevy

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The Daytona was a blast.

Problem is the chain in the trans and you need to go 1" for it to reliable power. I think if you went turbo, you'd come across this issue real quick with the additional weight of a PA being flung around.
That's the other issue. I just had a build done. Not in any hurry to blow it apart
 
That's the other issue. I just had a build done. Not in any hurry to blow it apart

You can throw a 4t80e in there easily since you have a Park Ave. Problem solved. For what it's worth, I never had any issues with my 4t65, and I beat the pies out of that thing in my PAU with 315 drag radials on that 2.55" pulley. I don't think you would have problems just street driving...unless you are launching.
 
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