Tesla Product Announcement at 7pm Central Time

sickmint79

I Drink Your Milkshake
Mar 2, 2008
27,079
16,897
grayslake
Tesla isn't going to be around much longer either way. They are bleeding cash left and right with this new vehicle development, and the electric shit just isn't catching on with mainstream America. The stock price falling greatly over the past several months in a major indicator.

that doesn't make sense to me. people at least think they want it and think they know what they are getting, look at all the pre-orders. they could be profitable as the toys for rich people's niche but think they can compete lower market and with the masses. the stock price is not within a world of a fair valuation so IMHO it makes sense for it to fall, i expect their ultimate valuation to be much lower, but i've certainly lost money trying to bet on that in the past. timeline is tough, especially when the fanboyism is strong.

That just makes me so happy. Not even about my speculative stock purchase which is going to pay off but just seeing what this guy does. Between the Hyperloop, SpaceX and Tesla, I mean fuck. And then there's that little footnote in his past where he started PayPal. :rofl:

hyperloop seems even less likely that a massive market share of full EVs for normal people. that's like a little prison death tube that wants to go straight but there's all sorts of shit in the way. if anyone but musk had proposed it would a single person even be building it today? i'm skeptical it ever really goes anywhere. EVs at least have their niches.

The Kink in Elon Musk's Hyperloop

They are very young compared to Ford. If and when the model 3 comes out that will be their affordable model. To offset costs.

The cars they produce are far greater than any Ford on the market.... exception limited production cars... Ford GT, gt350 etc

Elon does not know how to fail. Let's not count them out

the 3 doesn't have to just come out. it has to compete with other technology that is not standing still and it has to be affordable and it has to be profitable. the challenge, as it always is in business, is meeting all 3, not just 2 of them.

elon doesn't know how to fail is just cult of personality talking. this is part of why their stock price is crazy too. of course successful people know how to fail - many of them have done it quite often. just look at trump, he's failed in practically every market ;p
 

Mike K

TCG Elite Member
Apr 11, 2008
13,214
2,586
A 40K car is still expensive for what you're getting in the model 3, and it's still an electric car that has limited charging areas nationwide.

Ford cars don't have batteries that explode on them, they don't require a charging station that is only available in major cities, and a few outside areas. A Ford vehicle has support in every area in the country. They are mainstream.

Elon has done very well for himself, no doubt about it. And he is a very intelligent guy. But he is putting his eggs in one basket with this new model 3. That is something you do not do in business. He better hope the car doesn't have problems and people actually like it and buy them.

Still in the car so I can't go too nuts here but you have some reading to do. The problems you state largely don't exist. The exploding batteries for one, that's not a thing. That's never been a thing.

The other stuff is easily refuted as well. Make any business case you want for how much Tesla sucks. That's fine. I get that. But the stuff you listed reads like someone that has absolutely no knowledge of electric cars. Your concerns are the ones potential buyers put to rest on their first google search. :)
 

VenomousDSG

Don't Tread On Me
TCG Premium
Apr 30, 2006
20,817
22,332
Yorkville, il
Still in the car so I can't go too nuts here but you have some reading to do. The problems you state largely don't exist. The exploding batteries for one, that's not a thing. That's never been a thing.

The other stuff is easily refuted as well. Make any business case you want for how much Tesla sucks. That's fine. I get that. But the stuff you listed reads like someone that has absolutely no knowledge of electric cars. Your concerns are the ones potential buyers put to rest on their first google search. :)

Never once said Telsa "sucks". And i do think their cars are cool. But they did have issues with their first vehicles with the batteries exploding on a few occasion. There are other issues with their batteries as well.

Tesla Owners Encounter Problems with 12-Volt Battery | PluginCars.com

Consumer Reports' Tesla Model S Has More than Its Share of Problems - Consumer Reports News

Tesla Motors' Dirty Little Secret Is a Major Problem -- The Motley Fool

On a business aspect of it, it just isn't on par with combustion engines yet. It hasn't caught on. Electric vehicles are an industry that has been around over 3 decades. It's not new, it's just been more refined with Tesla. People still greatly prefer a gas vehicle for price, reliability, and other specs.

Do I want a vehicle that costs 40K, yet can only go 200 miles before it needs a recharge, AND I can only get my car recharged at a charging station in a major city? Hell no, not when I can buy a comparable gas vehicle for $25K, go twice the distance on a tank of gas, and has support EVERYWHERE.
 

Gone_2022

TCG Elite Member
Sep 4, 2013
13,094
7,525
The range issue has not been an "issue" for a while now. We do not know the different ranges yet of the model 3, we assume there will be multiple battery levels.

Also the car can be charged anywhere with a plug technically. Tesla has tons of stations and there are charge points all over. Look at a map, it looks like a shot gun peppered a tail gate with how many their are.

Also you said you don't want to have to charge at a point in a major city? Well I assume you have your own gas station at home then, otherwise you are filling your tank at a public gas station.


Not on par with combustion engines? The only car that can beat it are 2-4 million dollar hyper speed cars. The electric motor under normal use is far more efficient than a combustion car.
 

Mike K

TCG Elite Member
Apr 11, 2008
13,214
2,586
Never once said Telsa "sucks". And i do think their cars are cool. But they did have issues with their first vehicles with the batteries exploding on a few occasion.

No, they really didn't. Take it from me, someone that's owned 3 and is embarrassed to admit how much he knows about the different variations of the battery packs. They never had an exploding battery problem. The worst you'll see is they had a couple of incidents where debris on the road struck a corner of the battery and resulted in a slow fire. In the 2 or 3 cases this happened the car told the driver's to pull over and exit the vehicle before there was any fire. Tesla retrofitted shields on the front of the batteries in question. There has never been an issue with these batteries exploding though. Never.

There are other issues with their batteries as well.

And again, no. There are not. Not only are there no issues with the batteries but they have surpassed just about everyone's expectations in terms of degradation over time/ mileage. Understand how amazing that is that even on the the first revision "A pack" batteries like my last car had, they are seeing nearly no degradation after 4 years and tens of thousands of miles. That is uncanny. Wrap your head around how impressive that is. It's the first high capacity battery in a production car and not only did they get it good; they got it perfect. They got it better than anyone's expectations. That's incredible.


Man, I don't even know where to start here. The first link is about the 12v battery and not the car's battery pack, the second isn't about the battery at all and the third not only isn't about battery problems but is highhhhhhly subjective. Once I saw it was Motleyfool I understood why. It's an obvious hit piece. It's an attempt to manipulate the stock price.

But these three links read like you just went to Google and searched for "model S bad" and then just posted the first results you got. They don't back your original claim of exploding batteries, they don't back your other claim of battery problems and worst of all: they're not even about the same problem. Every article is about something different.

On a business aspect of it, it just isn't on par with combustion engines yet. It hasn't caught on. Electric vehicles are an industry that has been around over 3 decades. It's not new, it's just been more refined with Tesla.

More refined? You don't think that's a bit of an oversimplification? Before Tesla came along name the longest range and fastest all electric car that existed. You can't. And do you know why you can't? Because it was likely neither fast nor capable of going very far and thus nobody wanted one. When you don't build a product people want or you build a product people want but with severe limitations they don't buy it. So yeah, a shitty version of electric cars that nobody wanted might very well have existed for 30 years. In fact, people here will tell you it existed for over 100 years. That doesn't change the fact that every all electric car before the Model S had very serious shortcomings that Tesla all but eliminated with the S and X.

Do I want a vehicle that costs 40K, yet can only go 200 miles before it needs a recharge, AND I can only get my car recharged at a charging station in a major city? Hell no, not when I can buy a comparable gas vehicle for $25K, go twice the distance on a tank of gas, and has support EVERYWHERE.

Well, incorrect assumptions about charging aside, that's fine but given the wildly inaccurate information you've posted so far, it seems to me you have your mind made up and are working backwards to support your conclusion.
 

Mike K

TCG Elite Member
Apr 11, 2008
13,214
2,586
hyperloop seems even less likely that a massive market share of full EVs for normal people. that's like a little prison death tube that wants to go straight but there's all sorts of shit in the way. if anyone but musk had proposed it would a single person even be building it today? i'm skeptical it ever really goes anywhere. EVs at least have their niches.

Honestly I don't know what will come of it but I'll tell you this much: I very much enjoy watching Elon throw shit at the wall and seeing what sticks.

This is a guy that started Paypal, created Space-X and the first re-usable rocket, created the first mass appeal electric car which also happens to be the quickest car in the world, brought us a little taste of autonomy before anyone said it could be done and then did it again by bringing level 5 autonomy not only years before anyone said it could exist but with technology that people said wouldn't work.

So as far as I'm concerned, he can spout of any hair brained idea he wants and I'll eat it up.
 

MikeyLikesIt

PHEV Enthusiast
Jun 11, 2009
2,866
727
Downers Grove
Didn't you recently cancel your Model 3 reservation because you thought the company was going to file chapter 11 and keep your $1000 deposit? I know you then went on to buy a new Model S. It just seems like your reacting which ever way the wind is blowing?

I am a big fan of Elon and the Tesla line. I still have my reserve in for the Tesla 3. I want to see how much above and beyond the $35k I will need to get a decent vehicle. I believe the autonomous driving will save more lives than it will take. The media will spin other ways as well as the people betting against Tesla.
 

Mike K

TCG Elite Member
Apr 11, 2008
13,214
2,586
Didn't you recently cancel your Model 3 reservation because you thought the company was going to file chapter 11 and keep your $1000 deposit? I know you then went on to buy a new Model S. It just seems like your reacting which ever way the wind is blowing?

I am a big fan of Elon and the Tesla line. I still have my reserve in for the Tesla 3. I want to see how much above and beyond the $35k I will need to get a decent vehicle. I believe the autonomous driving will save more lives than it will take. The media will spin other ways as well as the people betting against Tesla.

I cancelled my Model 3 because the company seemed to be desperate for cash a few months ago. That was pretty concerning. Had I not bought the S I likely would not have cancelled the 3. The logic I gave in my post was that I could pull that $1000 out and use it in the Model S I'm buying now without taking money out of the company's coffers. So I was guaranteed I wouldn't lose my money but I wasn't costing Tesla any money.

But I try to be objective and in doing so I'm the first one to admit that Tesla has huge barriers in front of them and I'm not confident it's going to be smooth sailing the entire way. I'm excited to see though.
 

Grabber

Oh Hai
Dec 11, 2007
4,363
860
Wheeling, IL
The range issue has not been an "issue" for a while now. We do not know the different ranges yet of the model 3, we assume there will be multiple battery levels.

Also the car can be charged anywhere with a plug technically. Tesla has tons of stations and there are charge points all over. Look at a map, it looks like a shot gun peppered a tail gate with how many their are.

Also you said you don't want to have to charge at a point in a major city? Well I assume you have your own gas station at home then, otherwise you are filling your tank at a public gas station.


Not on par with combustion engines? The only car that can beat it are 2-4 million dollar hyper speed cars. The electric motor under normal use is far more efficient than a combustion car.

Beat it, how? 0-60, 1/4 mile, etc?
 

Gone_2022

TCG Elite Member
Sep 4, 2013
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7,525
i don't see why anyone even cares about that stuff really. is 10 seconds really slow compared to 11 or 12? i mean sure, it is in one way --- but also it's hardly slow, and there's only so much you can do and use something like that. plus the supercar can turn, and looks like sex.

Because you are getting this performance from a family 4 door car that is still priced in the area of a high end BMW and Mercedes. It is not priced in the LaFerrari category or even a Huracan Level. Because you can silently get some groceries, and at a stop light ruin even the most expensive Naperville supercar at the next stoplight.
 

Grabber

Oh Hai
Dec 11, 2007
4,363
860
Wheeling, IL
0-100 seems to be their untouchable area. Give or take a bit depending on the car it is lined up against. The 0-60 time in the P100D is 2.5 seconds and quarter in 10.7.

That 0-60 time is nearly unmatchable in a current production car with an ICE engine.

The 0-60 is great, but, they fall off a bit past the 1/8th mile.

Tesla P100D - Fastest "ever" time, not exactly a normal run, 10.7 @ 121 MPH, costs 135K+.
2017 Ford GT is 0-60 in low 3's and runs high 10's, most likely traps 125+ MPH, costs 400K.
Nissan GTR is 0-60 in 2.7-2.8 and runs high 10's, traps 120-122 and costs 120K.
Lambo LP750 Aventador runs 10.4's @ 135+ MPH, costs 500K.
Porsche 918 Spyder ran high 9's @ 145MPH+. was under 1M.

There are many more cars from the factory that are under the 2-3 million dollar range you suggested that can destroy a tesla in every performance aspect.
 

Gone_2022

TCG Elite Member
Sep 4, 2013
13,094
7,525
The 0-60 is great, but, they fall off a bit past the 1/8th mile.

Tesla P100D - Fastest "ever" time, not exactly a normal run, 10.7 @ 121 MPH, costs 135K+.
2017 Ford GT is 0-60 in low 3's and runs high 10's, most likely traps 125+ MPH, costs 400K.
Nissan GTR is 0-60 in 2.7-2.8 and runs high 10's, traps 120-122 and costs 120K.
Lambo LP750 Aventador runs 10.4's @ 135+ MPH, costs 500K.
Porsche 918 Spyder ran high 9's @ 145MPH+. was under 1M.

There are many more cars from the factory that are under the 2-3 million dollar range you suggested that can destroy a tesla in every performance aspect.

Factory Production cars? Many many many cars that can destroy the Tesla in every performance aspect?

Please provide the list. It must be a production car. The LaFerrari is not, The Ford GT is not, the 918 is not, The P1 is not.


I will await the list of factory cars you can go out and purchase today that will beat it in every category.

Oh..... and thats not a super or hyper car that can seat 5 people, with a trunk and has 4 doors that you can drive to and from chicago every single day in traffic
 

Gone_2022

TCG Elite Member
Sep 4, 2013
13,094
7,525
...................theyre fucking production cars. Just b/c theyre sold out doesnt mean they arent production cars :rofl:

Ok... so before the cars were sold out if you.... Mook had the funds could you walk into a Ford dealer and say I would like to purchase a Ford GT. Nope.

Could you walk into a Ferrari Dealer and say I would like to Purchase a LaFerrari..... again NOPE>
 
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