Burger Motorsports - AVOID THEM AT ALL COST

[Grabber]

As someone that has to deal with these sort of things from International customers, here goes.

Their return policy is not hidden or hard to find as you said in your original post. It's at the top a line or two down in bold.

Secondly, while I'm sure they appreciate you calling the day you received the product to return it, it probably wasn't good on your part to wait weeks before shipping it back out to them. Considering the fact that you have so much going on, you should have taken extra steps, explained that you're out of town and won't be able to ship back until xyz date. That way you make sure there won't be any issues returning the product.

Hopefully this works out, but, I think what is happening is you're using your busy life to justify this and excuse the fact that it took you so long to send the item back you're saying is wrong. It goes both ways. Life happens to everyone, they are in business to make money, not make sure they work around everyone's busy life.

Good luck with filing the CC charges.

 

[jason05gt]

Did you email them that there was going to be a delay in shipping the unit back? If not, you're kind of at fault for not communicating to them. They probably thought you used it and then wanted to ship it back for a refund.

 

[Pressure Ratio]

I have had a couple great experiences buying from Berger Motorsports.

I can not say the same about dealing with Dasfinc attempting to buy parts from me.


Since the company has the part I would guess the credit card company will refund the purchase, despite the terms. They seem to like to side with the card holder.

 

[blakbearddelite]

^This, I would agree the CC company will likely provide a refund as the seller has the part and there is proof of it.

 

[Dasfinc]

Forgot to close this out;

I gave all the communication I had with Burger (Strictly email, as they don't have a support phone number, and the Chase CC Claims department LAUGHED at Burgers terms and conditions, and said on the phone "Yea, no way we are going to let that slide"

The final straw on this for Chase was that their terms and conditions state that if you ship an item back as a return, and if it doesn't meet their return policy, they can keep the item and your money.

Chase refunded me my money and took it back from Burger.

Burger ignored the BBB Complaint and took the negative hit.

 

[Jeffs FRC]

After reading this, it seems OP was at fault and should not have received a refund.

You got your money back so good for you, but you should remove the BBB complaint seeing as you can't read...

 

[Dasfinc]

After reading this, it seems OP was at fault and should not have received a refund.

You got your money back so good for you, but you should remove the BBB complaint seeing as you can't read...

14 day term is buried in terms and conditions, and was not prominently displayed.

I informed the vendor I intended to return the day it arrived it as the product received was not as shown in the images, completely lacking a feature I required.

They stated that I was fine to return it at that point.

I shipped it within 30 days, which is pretty standard for returns, to which they tried denying a return, for a product which did not match the photos shown in the documentation (pass-Through OBD2 port).

They then tried saying they were going to keep my money, and the product.

The fact that the product they sent me did not match their documentation or images is the bottom line here still, I'm thinking that people may have missed that. No terms and conditions on earth can put that back on me....

 

[P40E]

That shit about the return policy is fucked up .

So technically then , EVERYTHING that gets sent back to them saying product is bad , defective , or wrong , the company can just say it doesn't meet their policy and keep it AND your money .

 

[Turk]

Seems like a bad experience, and the return policy is kinda fucked up, but this will not sway me from looking at their products in the future.

 

[Dasfinc]

That shit about the return policy is fucked up .

So technically then , EVERYTHING that gets sent back them saying product is bad , defective , or wrong , the company can just say it doesn't meet their policy and keep it AND your money .

The fact that the Chase claims rep was full-on laughing when I showed him their terms just goes to show how fucked up it is.

Seems like a bad experience, and the return policy is kinda fucked up, but this will not sway me from looking at their products in the future.

Dinan has taken a STRONG foot-hold into the market, and offers better products, and better support, for a lower cost (depends on the product obviously).

I Urge you to look at their offerings and others before Burgers. I think they are loosing market share, which is why they are being so shitty with their return policies specifically.

 

[Turk]

6 years ago, Dinan was the worst product you could buy for a BMW simply because they cost 3X more than the competition and only got you 70% of the performance. I doubt I'll even consider them.

 

[Dasfinc]

6 years ago, Dinan was the worst product you could buy for a BMW simply because they cost 3X more than the competition and only got you 70% of the performance. I doubt I'll even consider them.

Dinantronics is offering real tuning solutions now (which was a definite short coming in the market), I purchased their setup for the cooper after the Burger fiasco and am happy with it.

Either way, I'm just saying look elsewhere first.

 

[P40E]

Bmw's in general are about 3x more than other cars and not much gains .

 

[Blood on Blood]

Jon, their support guy, is frankly being a prick.

They literally have the item back, it was a straight forward return, they are trying to stand behind a garbage "terms" agreement that has a 14 day return policy, which is just super unrealistic.

The way they are acting is as though $600 will make or break them.

So, you rubbed the guy the wrong way, delayed sending back the product and in turn their stance is “piss on you” and / or “we’ll drag our own feet on settling this out”?

CC company will address one way or another.

 

[Dasfinc]

So, you rubbed the guy the wrong way, delayed sending back the product and in turn their stance is “piss on you” and / or “we’ll drag our own feet on settling this out”?

CC company will address one way or another.

You may want to go back and read the whole thing.

They sent a product that was not as described, that's the bottom line.

They tried standing behind their 14 day return policy to avoid eating the return, Chase refunded me my money after laughing about their policy and the stance they had taken.

 

[Turk]

Bmw's in general are about 3x more than other cars and not much gains .

Wrong.

 

[Blood on Blood]

You may want to go back and read the whole thing.

They sent a product that was not as described, that's the bottom line.

They tried standing behind their 14 day return policy to avoid eating the return, Chase refunded me my money after laughing about their policy and the stance they had taken.

What’s the point of this thread?

An analyst laughing = self-gratification? Probably doesn’t give a shit one way or another and is more concerned about the rising backlog of other cases.

 

[Jeffs FRC]

14 day term is buried in terms and conditions, and was not prominently displayed.

I informed the vendor I intended to return the day it arrived it as the product received was not as shown in the images, completely lacking a feature I required.

They stated that I was fine to return it at that point.

I shipped it within 30 days, which is pretty standard for returns, to which they tried denying a return, for a product which did not match the photos shown in the documentation (pass-Through OBD2 port).

They then tried saying they were going to keep my money, and the product.

The fact that the product they sent me did not match their documentation or images is the bottom line here still, I'm thinking that people may have missed that. No terms and conditions on earth can put that back on me....

I just went and looked for myself...the 14 day return policy is nowhere near "buried" in their terms and conditions. It is VERY CLEARLY visible in their terms and conditions page which was EASILY found by clicking on their TERMS AND CONDITIONS link on the same page as the tuner you bought.

And what again did this tuner not have that you thought was included? It's pretty clearly described on the page what you're buying. At least to me...

 

[willizm]

Was it assumed that because the 14 day period wasn’t prominent that they didn’t have any grace period at all? I mean just because you don’t see it flashing in your face doesn’t mean you can assume it’s super lax. 14 days doesn’t seem too outside of the norm to me. I’ve bought from this vendor numerous times and never a single issue with their products. Will buy again.

Also I’ve known tons of people that have used their stuff and no one has ever complained about return policy. It’s not like people are like “yeah their tune is great but that return policy is a sticking point for me”

 

[Dasfinc]

And what again did this tuner not have that you thought was included? It's pretty clearly described on the page what you're buying. At least to me...

Again; The return policy is irrelevant if the product is not as described in my opinion. It's not like I sat on the product for a year and decided to return it, it was 30 days.

Anyone that feels otherwise has no experience in customer service what so ever.

The user manual/installation material, along with other documentation showed a Pass-Through OBD2 port, product arrived with a cable that was not a pass-through design. Which meant I could not use my ScanGauge in conjunction with it.

 

[Jeffs FRC]

Again; The return policy is irrelevant if the product is not as described in my opinion.

Anyone that feels otherwise has no experience in customer service what so ever.

The user manual/installation material, along with other documentation showed a Pass-Through OBD2 port, product arrived with a cable that was not a pass-through design. Which meant I could not use my ScanGauge in conjunction with it.

Did the product manufacturer change the design or something?

 

[Dasfinc]

Did the product manufacturer change the design or something?

Burger acknowledged they made design change (I assume because it was a cheaper cable), but said that they didn't mention anywhere in their documentation that the pass-through OBD2 supported anything, and that was their stance. Basically I shouldn't have assumed that the plug (despite clearly being a pass-through design) could be used for anything.

End of the day; the defensiveness that they took on the matter instead of just making an exemption is what upset me. If a product has a physically apparent feature in the photos in the User/Install material I do not feel it's reasonable that I should make the assumption that I cannot make use of it.

Either way, I got my refund, it's a shame it had to be through my CC, and not through the vendor.

 

[Mike K]

Forgot to close this out;

I gave all the communication I had with Burger (Strictly email, as they don't have a support phone number, and the Chase CC Claims department LAUGHED at Burgers terms and conditions, and said on the phone "Yea, no way we are going to let that slide"

The final straw on this for Chase was that their terms and conditions state that if you ship an item back as a return, and if it doesn't meet their return policy, they can keep the item and your money.
.

The fact that the Chase claims rep was full-on laughing when I showed him their terms just goes to show how fucked up it is.

Ah Dan... dude... The Chase rep's job is to make you feel like Chase has your back. I know you really want to think that there was some case that was gone over and your solid proof and proper documentation helped you prevail. In reality, you can file a chargeback for any reason and you'll almost always win. People don't realize that our entire chargeback system is based on trust. I could buy something online tomorrow, file a chargeback a month from now and win with zero repercussions. The credit card companies default in your favor. I recently had a case where I proved without a doubt that the customer sent us back an empty box... Still lost. They didn't even look at our evidence, just closed in the customer's favor. Don't take this "victory" as some sort of vindication. You would have won either way.

Dinan has taken a STRONG foot-hold into the market, and offers better products, and better support, for a lower cost (depends on the product obviously).

Granted I've been out of the BMW scene for 2 years now but in my experience Dinan was always the worst. They were the most expensive, least innovative and offered the lowest power gains.

6 years ago, Dinan was the worst product you could buy for a BMW simply because they cost 3X more than the competition and only got you 70% of the performance. I doubt I'll even consider them.

Yes, all of this.

 

[DanJ]

Dinan has been a part of that “driven performance brands” group since 2013 with B&M, Hurst, Flowmaster and now APR also. Not sure if that’s made them better or worse.