3800 WBS intercooler install progress....

[Sinister Drag Designs]

seems like low boost for a 2.55

 

[Kyle]

Originally posted by 98 TGP TOY@Sep 15 2006, 06:52 PM
Where did I say that ZZP invented the air/water intercooler?  Where did I say that ZZP invented the sandwich core air/water intercooler? 

But of course you mis-read what I said, otherwise you wouldnt have come up with completely wrong assumptions. 

ZZP was the first 3800 company to buy heater cores from various applications and test them as intercooler cores for our vehicles.  They are the ONLY 3800 company to run them on their vehicles for longetivity research.  They are the ONLY 3800 company to build a custom supercharger dyno to test the different cores and find the best core. 

ZZP did not see that another company had wide success with a sandwich heater core, then copy their design.  ZZP didnt allow pre-orders for their ICer weeks before ever putting a prototype on a test vehicle.  ZZP didnt sell their ICer weeks after testing their first Prototype.  ZZP doesnt advertise that their kit is superior to all others on the market, with ZERO testing or proof of any kind.  ZZP didnt find a core and say "hey this is the most dense, it must be the best" and then start selling. 

All I ask is that credit is given where its due, and the credit for sandwich intercoolers in our market is with ZZP.  Did I say dont buy Wbodystore ICers?  No, all I did was give credit to ZZP for researching these intercoolers on our cars, which allowed Wbodystore to bring out their intercooler at a cheaper price. 

Never said you were greedy and heartless, Mike.  Your a business man.  Your latest ICer is going to bring in the best profit margin out of all your intercoolers to-date.  Thats what a business is for.  Thats the same reason that you buy ebay strut tower bars and sell them at 80% mark-up.  You're here to make money, thats what a business does. 

Mike

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why dont you save that crap for clubgp instead of shitting up someones thread?

let the guy enjoy his product and save this shit for the jerkoffs that fight over it day after day on club gp.

 

[Mike K]

There's an 11 page thread covering this subject on Club GP in which you participated Mike. I think it's fair to say that all sides voiced themselves quite loudly. I even went so far as to contact you off forum to explain to you how we handle our R&D as it seems you had some misconceptions in that original thread.

There's nothing I can say about this that I haven't already said and I won't get dragged into an argument online just for the sake of arguing.

If you care to envelop yourself in the drama you can search on Club GP for the 11 page thread. Dan's post was covering how his intercooler was working, not the history of it's design.

 

[phat_ridegt]

2.55 pulley, i havent gone through the scans completely, but the most boost i saw on the computer was 12.03, it may spike a little higher, but i need both hands and eyes on the road at wot lol. not sure if the #'s are right or not...im using ron's belt wrap kit, and a VERY tight belt, so it's not slipping. im running a stage4 blower, xp cam, togs, and the intercooler.

 

[M@]

Originally posted by phat_ridegt@Sep 15 2006, 07:54 PM
back on topic, ill have some scans in a little while...950 o2's 20.5* 12psi....0kr

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that's it?

950 = teh RICH

 

[Sinister Drag Designs]

i agree, that is pretty rich for that setup
i would guess boost would be be more around 13-14. but thats just from what ive heard other cars have.

mat, how much boost are you running now with the XPZ

 

[dole21]

Originally posted by phat_ridegt@Sep 15 2006, 06:54 PM
back on topic, ill have some scans in a little while...950 o2's 20.5* 12psi....0kr

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Nice Dan, Im jealous lol


good luck trying to stay on topic here... grade school kids have a short attention span

 

[M@]

Originally posted by SINr247@Sep 15 2006, 09:10 PM
i agree, that is pretty rich for that setup
i would guess boost would be be more around 13-14. but thats just from what ive heard other cars have.

mat, how much boost are you running now with the XPZ

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I haven't gotten WOT runs on the 2.55 yet

2.7 was making 12.5 and 2.6 was making about a pound more at 13.5

I need to get this IFR table fixed before I really get cooking with this setup. The 65lb IFR table provided in the PowrTuner is pretty damned goofy, and is so high in the lower MAP ranges that it's running SUPER lean at WOT, we're talking lean enough to feel like a rev limiter (and take O2's to less than 100 ).

I'm gonna try to get some solid tune time in on it this weekend, and hopefully have it in better working order by the end of sunday.

MT

 

[phat_ridegt]

i know its rich. its probably 10.1 maybe. maybe a little higher, i havent made ANY adjustments to the tune. just wanted to see what it would do. wonder why my boost is a little lower, i havent looked at the full scan, but when watching the laptop, the most i saw was 12.0x or something. it may spike higher but i dont know for sure

 

[M@]

what pulley?

 

[Fish]

Mike, having ANOTER party without inviting me??

Phat Ride, sounds like you need to setup a date with the dyno on our mod day.

 

[phat_ridegt]

Originally posted by FastGS88@Sep 16 2006, 01:02 AM
what pulley?

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2.55

 

[phat_ridegt]

Originally posted by Fish@Sep 16 2006, 01:33 AM
Phat Ride, sounds like you need to setup a date with the dyno on our mod day.

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if all goes as planned, and i make some extra cash soon (brett) ill be there. id like to race as well before the winter modding begins.

 

[M@]

12lbs on a 2.55 and stock heads ain't right...I dont care what core you're pushing through.

 

[phat_ridegt]

i dunno...heres the scan..the tune is way off, but it is a start. 13.0 psi is the max...http://www.scandepot.net/viewscan.php?pk=2865

 

[xierxior]

12.05lbs at 4600rpm then 11.46lbs at 6000rpm.
the blower seems to be pulsing pretty bad if you look at his scans it's gaining/loosing a pound or two rather consistently when it should be slowly/more steadily climbing.
when you're WOT does the power vary at all as the rpms are climbing? I mean do you feel any flat spots?

 

[phat_ridegt]

no i dont feel any flat spots..bu im wondering if the map is bad...

 

[Mike K]

The boost defintely should be ramping up with rpm. How is the vehicle's drivability otherwise? Any symptoms of a vacuum leak?

 

[M@]

get those freakin fuel trims fixed before you go banging on the car anymore

That's way too much timing to be commanding on a street driven 2.55 setup
Way too much fuel too, rich as balls

Start looking for leaks in the lines to the MAP. That doesn't appear to be belt slip related.

MT

 

[M@]

Originally posted by Mike K@Sep 17 2006, 10:35 PM
The boost defintely should be ramping up with rpm.  How is the vehicle's drivability otherwise?  Any symptoms of a vacuum leak?

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admitting defeat?
you remember our discussion...

 

[phat_ridegt]

no drivability issues at all...car runs great. i did use brake cleaner on all the vacum lines to check for a leak, but it's tough to tell with the cam. im done roddin on the car now until it gets a tune, but it pulls very very hard.
as for the belt slip, i know thats not an issue, i have a VERY tight belt with ron vogel's belt wrap kit. hopefully ron will be able to get this thing figured out this week.

 

[MIKES3]

Dam dude, very nice. I see 12lbs of boost on a 3.2 pulley. I can also say I wish I saw 0* degrees of knock with a full IC, Headers and 1.8 Rockers, but i'm stuck with 3-5 degrees of knock @ 22* of timing. Granted I am running a SSIC heat exchanger, but I dont see that taking away that much knock. Needless to say i'm waiting for a piston to chip.

 

[Mike K]

admitting defeat?
you remember our discussion...
smile.gif

What was that, about two years ago now eh? Yes. Our discussion led me to do a lot of research in the area and correct a lot of my own misconceptions. You might have even noticed me using the word adiabatic in it's correct usage in the recent years. :lol:

I'm embarrassed that we ever had that discussion. Then again, there are posts where Zooomer is asking what thermostat he should be running in his car so I suppose we all start somewhere.

 

[M@]

Originally posted by Mike K@Sep 18 2006, 12:32 AM

admitting defeat?
you remember our discussion...
smile.gif

What was that, about two years ago now eh? Yes. Our discussion led me to do a lot of research in the area and correct a lot of my own misconceptions. You might have even noticed me using the word adiabatic in it's correct usage in the recent years. :lol:

I'm embarrassed that we ever had that discussion. Then again, there are posts where Zooomer is asking what thermostat he should be running in his car so I suppose we all start somewhere.

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heh...point taken

 

[Fish]

Originally posted by MIKES3@Sep 17 2006, 10:47 PM
Dam dude, very nice. I see 12lbs of boost on a 3.2 pulley. I can also say I wish I saw 0* degrees of knock with a full IC, Headers and 1.8 Rockers, but i'm stuck with 3-5 degrees of knock @ 22* of timing. Granted I am running a SSIC heat exchanger, but I dont see that taking away that much knock. Needless to say i'm waiting for a piston to chip.

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I meant to ask you if you were running the SSIC pump as well. If so, I bet a new pump and heat exchanger will definatly help.