KR on stock car

[Boreas]

Hey guys, long time no see.

So ive had my Aeroforce Intercepter installed on my 1997 SSEi and working for a good month now. The one thing I noticed is that I frequently get KR on mild acceleration, anywhere from 1-3 and one time as high as 6. When it was cold and around +- 40 degrees outside, when I travel on a highway and I want to speed up a bit, I apply about 30% throttle and it will spike up to as high as 4. But on dead stop and when I WOT it, I get zero KR. These days when its warmer at around 65 degrees, I get as high as six when accelerating while moving, but have not yet tried from a dead stop.

Ive never had experience with this before and im trying to learn and gain information, and im trying to establish a baseline/good health of my engine as I plan on modding it this year. Is this normal, and if not what should I be doing? Of course, this car sees 93 octane, although it is poisoned by 10% of corn juice. Thanks!

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[Mook]

if its immediately spiking then recovering, its quite possibly false knock. colleen's car (gypsy on here) does that. from a dig going wot, not an ounce of kr. rolling into it at maybe 10-30% throttle (but not going wot), knock all over the place. spikes then recovers. none of it gradually builds or rises w/ the rpms.

but, some cars are just plagued by kr in stock form. 1-2 degrees is sometimes normal sadly.

 

[Mook]

you could always try tossing in some higher octane. if the knock stays, its false. if it goes away, its real. (most of the time. i'm sure that method isnt a 100% constant).

 

[PANDA]

Do some maintenance on the car and scan again. Plugs, wires, fuel filter, fluids, clean TB, maf etc. Stock cars can get knock. I scanned a friends bone stock 04 impala SS and it got 4 deg. It was nearly brand new also.

 

[Handsome Jesus]

My car does the same thing, and I don't believe it is an issue. I think most cars have some knock from the factory. the timing is there for economy, and it has a Knock Retard system there for a reason. It is probably not much to worry about, but the car will likely run better if you can get rid of it.

 

[Mook]

Do some maintenance on the car and scan again. Plugs, wires, fuel filter, fluids, clean TB, maf etc. Stock cars can get knock. I scanned a friends bone stock 04 impala SS and it got 4 deg. It was nearly brand new also.

 

[Alacran]

I drive a KR monster!

 

[02BlueGT]

The main issue causing KR is that you are going 30% throttle in 4th gear. It is not enough to trigger the PE, and you are putting huge loads on the engine accelerating in overdrive. if you manually drop it to 3, or wait for it to down shift, then boost, you will avoid the KR

 

[Mook]

also

ive learned to basically avoid most false bs on her car. never had this problem on my previous gtp or the daytona, but her car is a different beast

 

[DanJ]

I switched to ZZP TCC lockup tables that i got from Panda and have eliminated almost all of my part throttle KR issues.

 

[Ron Vogel]

The main issue causing KR is that you are going 30% throttle in 4th gear. It is not enough to trigger the PE, and you are putting huge loads on the engine accelerating in overdrive. if you manually drop it to 3, or wait for it to down shift, then boost, you will avoid the KR

There's a table in the powertuner that allows you to tune for this. I drop my afr -.5 to -1.5 in that no man's land of 50-70 mph, 4th gear, 15-30% throttle. Pretty common KR area; the stock timing in this area is really low too. I bumped mine up about 10 degrees over stock and it really helped gas milage. My commute is generally pretty good; all highway speeds at the hours I drive. I've been seeing high 30's on the highway, but around mid to low 20's around town.

If my wife borrows the car, milage drops under 20...so milage is very driver dependant!

 

[TommyGloves]

The main issue causing KR is that you are going 30% throttle in 4th gear. It is not enough to trigger the PE, and you are putting huge loads on the engine accelerating in overdrive. if you manually drop it to 3, or wait for it to down shift, then boost, you will avoid the KR

You can also let off the accelerator or lightly tap the brake and get back into heavy throttle right away. (Letting off the gas or tapping the brake pedal unlocks the converter.)

 

[10sec]

When my stock junk was stock I turned off the knock sensors and gained 4mph in the 1/4. The knock sensors are junk I swear they read false on 75% of the w-bodies. They were showing 3-4* before I turned them off FWIW.

 

[PANDA]

I was waiting for the 10sec turn off the knock sensors post.

 

[10sec]

Just seems like some cars even running right, are plagued with knock that isn't real. Not all cars though, take my other car for example. When supercharged and non-i/c'd it would get 2-4° of KR. Now turbo'd+i/c'd it doesn't get any, even on pump gas. Pump gas wasn't even an option on the supercharged setup. So I

 

[Boreas]

Seems im ok then, I know when I go WOT from dead stop it stays zero. I do think its odd that the KR degree goes up a little when the weather warms up, or when I accelerate from rolling stop it retards only when engine is warm, but not when cold. Im going to try to do some carbon cleaning this weekend and see if that helps, but at least I know some is to be expected. Thanks!

Oh yea id like Ron's tune cus that's some impressive mileage.

 

[02BlueGT]

Seems im ok then, I know when I go WOT from dead stop it stays zero. I do think its odd that the KR degree goes up a little when the weather warms up, or when I accelerate from rolling stop it retards only when engine is warm, but not when cold. Im going to try to do some carbon cleaning this weekend and see if that helps, but at least I know some is to be expected. Thanks!

Oh yea id like Ron's tune cus that's some impressive mileage.

Knock sensors do not turn on until engine temps are above 150ish

 

[10sec]

Oh yea id like Ron's tune cus that's some impressive mileage.

The tune does help, but remember the key part to his point. It's all about how you drive. They are monsters on the highway though, the long gears really help keep the tank full.

 

[firemandan1700]

I switched to ZZP TCC lockup tables that i got from Panda and have eliminated almost all of my part throttle KR issues.

Care to share

 

[Ron Vogel]

Care to share

1. You can turn off the knock sensors by specifying the temp they start functioning at (stock is different for different years)

2. The TC lock up specifies how much TQ is allowed before it locks/unlocks, and TQ management (which shows up as KR). You can increase/decrease allowed TQ...mine is at like 1084 or something.

 

[Alacran]

The only ways i got rid of my kr so far are removing the blower belt and running race fuel. I blame the iridium plugs i run but i do agree with what was mentioned earlier.