🔧 Technical Time to nut up - ZL1 mods/cost questions.

[Kaeghl]

I'd even love to check out the new supra.

You shut your whore mouth.


oh sorry, knee jerk reaction. Might as well get the bmw z4, because they are the same car. For either late 22 or 23 they are releasing a manual version, but so far with every iteration toyota is locking down more and more of the car to prevent modding and any real fun. Go ahead and look up mk5 supra and oil consumption issues.

 

[Blood on Blood]

Now tuning, thats another story. I super enjoy datalogging and being able to look at the tunefile and make tweaks. I have my own HPT MPVI2+ setup I can use. I wont be tuning this car from scratch, but i will make some tweaks here and there and basically datalog the shit out of it at the track.

So you are one of the guys who drives your Tuner bat shit crazy instead of locking the tuning device in the glove compartment and enjoying the car.

 

[Pro Stock John]

Nothing wrong with making logging and making changes at the drag strip, it's hard to get the shift points right.

 

[Jimy Bilmo]

Nothing wrong with making logging and making changes at the drag strip, it's hard to get the shift points right.

Definitely, and you can get real drag strip info/street info, versus being stuck on a dyno.

 

[ZXMustang]

So you are one of the guys who drives your Tuner bat shit crazy instead of locking the tuning device in the glove compartment and enjoying the car.

Why would I need to bother the tuner once its tuned just to make tweaks? I told you I have the HPT setup.

 

[Blood on Blood]

Why would I need to bother the tuner once its tuned just to make tweaks? I told you I have the HPT setup.

Your Tuner didn’t lock down the tune?

Every Joe, Dick and Harry - especially IT guys, like to over analyze the data logs and suggest tweaks, in your case make tweaks if the tune is not encrypted.

It’s like the patient looking at the EKG read out and telling the Cardiologist what needs to be done / to do next.

 

[ZXMustang]

Your Tuner didn’t lock down the tune?

Every Joe, Dick and Harry - especially IT guys, like to over analyze the data logs and suggest tweaks, in your case make tweaks if the tune is not encrypted.

It’s like the patient looking at the EKG read out and telling the Cardiologist what needs to be done / to do next.

No the tune wont be locked. I will be logging it at the track and making pulls on the street. And sending logs to the tuner. If its something easy/small, he will let me know what to change so I can flash it on the fly.

I might be playing with some e60 and whatnot, so the fuel blend and other settings will need to be changed. We will see what I can find around here for fuel. We also have 110 at this racegas station in clearwater. Its not a big deal. I wouldnt tweak anything without his direction.

And its not bothering the tuner when you know you will be going to the track and sending logs in for tweaks. As said especially with the trans.

These cars require a lot of street tuning because the fuel trims only work in closed loop. In openloop WOT, its all just manual values. So tuning for WOT on the dyno is only half the job.

Once I get the car on the street, with different fuels and cooler climates in the winter, I need to be able to log and make changes as needed. Saves him time to just email back what to change rather than having to open his machine and load my tunefile and make the changes, then send it to me. Or worse yet I have to go in for him to flash it.

 

[Blood on Blood]

No the tune wont be locked. I will be logging it at the track and making pulls on the street. And sending logs to the tuner. If its something easy/small, he will let me know what to change so I can flash it on the fly.

I might be playing with some e60 and whatnot, so the fuel blend and other settings will need to be changed. We will see what I can find around here for fuel. We also have 110 at this racegas station in clearwater. Its not a big deal. I wouldnt tweak anything without his direction.

And its not bothering the tuner when you know you will be going to the track and sending logs in for tweaks. As said especially with the trans.

These cars require a lot of street tuning because the fuel trims only work in closed loop. In openloop WOT, its all just manual values. So tuning for WOT on the dyno is only half the job.

Once I get the car on the street, with different fuels and cooler climates in the winter, I need to be able to log and make changes as needed. Saves him time to just email back what to change rather than having to open his machine and load my tunefile and make the changes, then send it to me. Or worse yet I have to go in for him to flash it.

Or you going with a unique / one off build or a known recipe?

 

[ZXMustang]

Or you going with a unique / one off build or a known recipe?

Custom grind cam next round of mods yes. Plus the trans tuning is very difficult from what I'm told.

 

[Blood on Blood]

Custom grind cam next round of mods yes. Plus the trans tuning is very difficult from what I'm told.

Cookie cutter build, minus a custom cam.

Does your tuner have vetted tunes for these cookie cutter builds? If Yes, then a couple revisions for the custom cam and you should be good?

 

[ZXMustang]

Cookie cutter build, minus a custom cam.

Does your tuner have vetted tunes for these cookie cutter builds? If Yes, then a couple revisions for the custom cam and you should be good?

I have no idea man. I don't know what you're looking for here.

 

[Blood on Blood]

I have no idea man. I don't know what you're looking for here.

I’m inquiring more into understanding your car and build. If you are using a known cookie cutter recipe, with a custom cam, your Tuner should have pre-vetted tunes for the build you are putting together, the variable being the custom cam.

After a couple data logs on the street and tune tweaks (revisions), your Tuner should have the car dialed in so that you can lock the tuning device in the glove box and not mess with it.

What is so special about your build that the traditional tuning process does not apply and you have to tweak / change the Tuner’s revision?

 

[Jimy Bilmo]

I’m inquiring more into understanding your car and build. If you are using a known cookie cutter recipe, with a custom cam, your Tuner should have pre-vetted tunes for the build you are putting together, the variable being the custom cam.

After a couple data logs on the street and tune tweaks (revisions), your Tuner should have the car dialed in so that you can lock the tuning device in the glove box and not mess with it.

What is so special about your build that the traditional tuning process does not apply and you have to tweak / change the Tuner’s revision?

Every car is not 100% the same. 01bluesnake could back that statement up. You can load the "cookie cutter" tune, from another car with the same parts, but then still have to make small tweaks here and there. What ZXMustang is doing, is getting data across numerous driving profiles and making those additional small tweaks himself, versus spending $$$ to have the tuner do it.

 

[ZXMustang]

Every car is not 100% the same. 01bluesnake could back that statement up. You can load the "cookie cutter" tune, from another car with the same parts, but then still have to make small tweaks here and there. What ZXMustang is doing, is getting data across numerous driving profiles and making those additional small tweaks himself, versus spending $$$ to have the tuner do it.

^This basically.^ I'd like to have a 93 tune, an e30 tune and maybe 110. Plus I will be putting on some cooling mods like a remote ice tank and a few other things. As said its nice to be able to adjust or flash a new tune when needed without the added time and cost to get back to the shop.

 

[Blood on Blood]

Every car is not 100% the same. 01bluesnake could back that statement up. You can load the "cookie cutter" tune, from another car with the same parts, but then still have to make small tweaks here and there. What ZXMustang is doing, is getting data across numerous driving profiles and making those additional small tweaks himself, versus spending $$$ to have the tuner do it.

Hence I referenced data logs and a couple revisions with the Tuner.

Granted, Brian is looking at multiple fuel options and potential additional cooling mods.

The Tuner can lock all those tunes in so he can plug & play depending on whatever creams his Twinkie for that day at the track. The tuning device will have those tunes saved.

I’m simply looking to understand what he is doing, as compared to the common TCG posting we see referencing him swapping cars on a regular basis. I’m also preparing for the potential of Brian messing with the tune, blowing the motor and a built motor is then around the corner (here comes 8s).

 

[Jimy Bilmo]

Hence I referenced data logs and a couple revisions with the Tuner.

Granted, Brian is looking at multiple fuel options and potential additional cooling mods.

The Tuner can lock all those tunes in so he can plug & play depending on whatever creams his Twinkie for that day at the track. The tuning device will have those tunes saved.

I’m simply looking to understand what he is doing, as compared to the common TCG posting we see referencing him swapping cars on a regular basis. I’m also preparing for the potential of Brian messing with the tune, blowing the motor and a built motor is then around the corner (here comes 8s).

It's all going to change based on ambient temp that day at the track, he wants to add timing at this RPM or pull some based on the new data. Now mix in different fuel tunes, etc. The bulk of the tuning is going to be done and he won't be changing it, this is just changing some fine details, which he will be changing a lot.

 

[Blood on Blood]

It's all going to change based on ambient temp that day at the track, he wants to add timing at this RPM or pull some based on the new data. Now mix in different fuel tunes, etc. The bulk of the tuning is going to be done and he won't be changing it, this is just changing some fine details, which he will be changing a lot.

And here comes the built motor and 8s

 

[Pro Stock John]

Having done some of my own trans tuning with my 2010, I can tell you it's handy to be able to make your own changes.

My 2010 went best of 11.8@114 FBO, and after I did heads and cam, my first past was an 11.6@117, the shift points were pretty off. After about 20 hits went 10.9@125 with a lot of changes in the trans stuff and we also played with timing advance a little.

 

[ZXMustang]

Yeah I have my laptop, cable and the HPT MPVI2+ plug to be able to log and edit/flash with. I used it extensively with Jeremy when we did my hellcat remotely. Thats why I got it. Needed it to load tunes and log with.

I dont plan to toast the motor obv and Im not planning on making major changes. But logging alone is worth the price of admission. I will most definitely have it running when I make a pass. If something hiccups, then I will have the data behind it. Its what helped us track down the original cat over temp problem with the hellcat.

 

[IceCreamAssassin]

These cars sounds so awesome with a nice cam in them.

 

[ZXMustang]

These cars sounds so awesome with a nice cam in them.

Agreed. Cam also helps increase highside fuel pressure. But its a big job on the camaro. oil pan, front cover and basically heads need to come off to do it right. Down to the bare block. Cam only no heads is another $5k job. Add heads and its like $10k.

 

[IceCreamAssassin]

Fuck, if that’s the case I’d do as much as possible all at once “while you’re in there”.

 

[Blood on Blood]

Agreed. Cam also helps increase highside fuel pressure. But its a big job on the camaro. oil pan, front cover and basically heads need to come off to do it right. Down to the bare block. Cam only no heads is another $5k job. Add heads and its like $10k.

$5k for a custom cam is worth rwhp / rwtq?

$15k for custom cam / heads is worth rwhp / rwtq?

 

[Pro Stock John]

Do the heads have to come off to swap lifters?

 

[Trinten]

I'm a little confused on the opening post, talking about how adding long tube headers will reduce boost, so you "must get a smaller pulley". Backpressure does not mean a reduction in power, it's merely a relative measuring system. There was a guy on the ThirdGen boards that had some big-honking turbo in his setup, hit limits, so put on a set of ported aftermarket heads, and even though he was laying down way more power, thought "something must be wrong" because his "boost pressure was way lower".

A few people tried to explain to him that the better flowing heads meant less measurable boost pressure, but he wasn't getting it. Is that the same thing here, or am I missing something?

As for the controls, I would say go with a FAST XFI and TCM setup. That way you can bypass any safeties you want, and let the stock ECM just run the instrument panel.