Build Quarter Life Crisis. It's a thing. v.GN

[Mr_Roboto]

From what I remember, the differences were minimal to none on the crank except the rear which was set up for a FWD pattern flexplate. This would have been nearing 2 decades ago now though. Car-part has a few of them listed, if you're willing to drive may be worth the cost just to get it. The other neat thing you get is what amount to Turbo T/A heads.

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

I want to say the series 2 cover bolts on except in the area of the oil passage goes into the block they moved and relocated some stuff so I think you have to drill and tap one new hole and plug another one but I it's been so long I can't remember.

 

[v6buicks]

How would I drive the pump? Would I need to use an LG3 crank gear too?

I wouldn't want to attempt an S2 cover. That sounds like a huge can of worms. Custom water pump pulley, custom heater hose setup, converting from s house to elbow, converting to the newer cam sensor (if that's even possible) and switching to the S2 timing chain. While I think this would all make the engine a lot nicer in terms of serviceability, I still want the engine to look mostly like an LC2.

 

[v6buicks]

Come to think of it. The Series 2 water pump actually spins the opposite direction of an LC2

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

Turbo Buick Gerotor Oil Conversion

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

I forgot Double D sent me that thread after I talk to him about the series 1

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

But see now you see why I like the series one short block so much since it's tall deck like the older engines but allows the use of all the newer s***.

Someday my dumbass is going to finally finish my series 1 tall deck & Series 2 symmetrical port hybrid

 

[v6buicks]

Damn. That's cool. If I had access to a few more tools, I'd be all over that. I think the old Buick pump and cover are going to have to go back on this time though.

 

[v6buicks]

I couldn't get this gerotor pump conversion out of my head even though I knew attempting it was going to throw me way behind schedule. Gathering some parts, and viewing the differences for myself was the only way I could talk myself out of it.

It's kind sad to think about, but Series 1 and earlier FWD 3.8 stuff is getting scarce. I cannot even find pictures of those timing covers anywhere on google except the Turbo Malibu page that turbocharged400sbc posted. Therefore, I'm only interested in trying this if I can use a combo of LC2 and Series 2/3 parts. Those are all still everywhere and

L36 on left LC2 on right. LG2/LG3 below.

Now here's the L36 cover with LC2 gasket to find all the differences. The crank sensor side looks fine, but the pump side needs work.

I've seen a couple really old turbobuick.com threads where Series 2 pumps were adapted, but the pictures are lost and the descriptions seem incomplete. I could probably figure out what needs to happen, but in the end I think it's a bit more work than it's worth. At least I can prime the Buick pump with a simple tool where I would need to make something to prime an S2 cover. I'd need to make new oil cooler lines and such too, so this is getting to be a big can of worms.

The other problem is that it doesn't seem like anybody ever figured out a solid way to drive the S2 pump gear. Fitting a chopped crank gear by chopping the back of the balancer resulted in cracked balancers. The whole point to me was having reliable and easily supported oil pressure. The fast start conversion with type 2 ignition also sounded like a very nice upgrade too, but I would probably be in just as good of shape with a lot less man-hours if I just upgraded the well supported Buick pump, and went to a TR6. I could probably just do the fast start type 2 without the gerotor as well, but that doesn't seem like a very straightforward conversion either.

I guess I just talked myself out of it. I want to keep this simple. I have enough on my plate right now.

 

[b4black]

I guess I just talked myself out of it. I want to keep this simple. I have enough on my plate right now.

Lots of GNs go super fast on the stock style oil pump.

 

[sktchy]

Even if you put it all back stock with an upgraded turbo it's still miles better than sticking an ls in it.

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

see the thing is that none of them have used the SII style crank gear and pump drive from a rollmaster set. double roller chain pitch is the same, you just cant use the short deck chain with the SII pump. keep in mind the early fwd/SI pump was double flat drive, where the late SI and SII was the spline drive. just need to cut the balancer snout shorter., no flats or splines on it.

i still insist that someday i will finish my SI/SII hybrid...

keep in mind that this style of gearotor would do well with a welded and remachined front cover for the pump scroll

i love the assortment of various oil filter necks on the old gal's

 

[v6buicks]

see the thing is that none of them have used the SII style crank gear and pump drive from a rollmaster set. double roller chain pitch is the same, you just cant use the short deck chain with the SII pump. keep in mind the early fwd/SI pump was double flat drive, where the late SI and SII was the spline drive. just need to cut the balancer snout shorter., no flats or splines on it.

i still insist that someday i will finish my SI/SII hybrid...

keep in mind that this style of gearotor would do well with a welded and remachined front cover for the pump scroll

i love the assortment of various oil filter necks on the old gal's

There were a couple guys on turbobuick playing around with the S2 pumps and gears. It sounds like your method of cutting down the timing gear and balancer was tried, but unsuccessful. I was curious about that because it sounded much easier, and I already had all the parts. I guess machining that much off the snout results in almost immediate failures though.

Long Promised Series II Oil Pump Thread

Ok, starting with the Timing Cover since it was the longest ago project. Sorry for the long thread and the out of focus pictures but this is archivial stuff and I don't want to take it apart again. What I started out with was a pile of 3 Buick timing covers with the need to make 1 that...

www.turbobuick.com

Flat drive sounds like the only way to go. If I had a mill and knowledge of how to use it without becoming TCGs second most clicked google link, I'd still be all over this conversion. After all the welding, machining, and crossing fingers, I think I'd end up with less confidence in the end-product than a stock pump and cover.

It's still not fully off the table. I might still get a couple spare covers and a balancer for my buddy to play with, but I don't want to rush it to be done this spring.

 

[v6buicks]

I don't think I mentioned this, but I managed to sell that beat to shit alky kit for full asking price. I was expecting to get laughed at, but I like to leave room for haggling when I can... Oh well. I'll take it! I think $300 is a deal for both of us. I think it's time to buy some abrasive media and TA goodies.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Just wanted to say on the oil pump, is the risk of trying to reinvent the wheel really worth it vs going with something that's just okay but not great? It's not like the 258 I'm trying to use that supposedly has a reputation for breaking cams and timing chains at higher RPM and where getting oil pump efficiency may mean less stress on parts.

 

[v6buicks]

Just wanted to say on the oil pump, is the risk of trying to reinvent the wheel really worth it vs going with something that's just okay but not great? It's not like the 258 I'm trying to use that supposedly has a reputation for breaking cams and timing chains at higher RPM and where getting oil pump efficiency may mean less stress on parts.

That's kinda my point too. I was all for it when It sounded easy. I was under the impression that the LG3 cover had the same upper half as the LC2 and would bolt right on. I had also completely failed to take the drive sprocket, crank sensor, and balancer into account, so it sounded like a cheap and easy upgrade until all the details started coming in. I think it would be a lot more common if it was.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

I don't think it'd be bad but the problem is good luck finding an LG3 to swipe parts from.

 

[v6buicks]

I've been waiting on parts since the last post. I finally got everything I needed to make progress again and almost immediately made a major mistake.

I forgot to take the valve core out to the compression test hose. Since the car has shaft rockers, I took those off before checking for TDC knowing that I wasn't going to put them back on to check the rest. That obviously didn't go well for me and I dropped the first valve right out of the guide. I don't even know where the seal went which is weird.

So fuck me. What's up, pistons?

Cylinder walls look kinda meh but oh well. Time to clean these gasket surfaces and shop for a head gasket.

This whole project officially sucks.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

That a Victor Reinz?

Doesn't look like a Blue.

You'll get there man, be patient. Look on the plus side, you can do those a hell of a lot easier now. Fucking jelly your project is moving, I'm too much of a wuss to hit the cold garage.

 

[v6buicks]

That a Victor Reinz?

Doesn't look like a Blue.

You'll get there man, be patient. Look on the plus side, you can do those a hell of a lot easier now. Fucking jelly your project is moving, I'm too much of a wuss to hit the cold garage.

Thanks man. I was told that the heads had never been off this car, but I have no idea.

I ended up buying 2 fel-pro 9441PTs and a set of stock replacement ARP 6 point bolts. I would have gone with 12 point of it weren't for the 2 month estimate, but 6 is totally fine.

220v garage heater is the second best garage mod I ever did, but my garage was already drywalled and insulated when I moved in. It certainly makes winter projects a million times more enjoyable. I almost didn't even go out tonight because my number one mod was failing. My fluorescent lights are burning out. I started looking for LED conversions or replacements but got frustrated. Maybe if I had full lighting, I wouldn't have made this mistake! ?

I just got a scary/bad idea, but now is the time to consider the fact that my intake runners are ported while the heads are not.... Should I at least make an attempt to smooth the transitions or just throw it back together with a bad step?

 

[sktchy]

So, cheap aluminum air fittings from tractor supply thread pretty nicely into spark plug holes and a little thread tape seals em up while your doin springs.

Get a can of copper spray and hang your gaskets and coat em before putting them on and it'll save alot of bs.

As for the heater I agree on the 220v and for the lights the leds are hit and miss. Mine are great but after a couple years I've got a couple tubes that only work when they want to and remember to take the ballasts out of your fixtures.

 

[v6buicks]

I'm thinking just buy a new intake. Ill spend half of what a virgin intake is worth on a timesert to fix the failed helicoil anyway.

 

[sktchy]

Or hear me out. Take it to somebody that can weld it back solid and tap a new hole in it?

 

[Mr_Roboto]

LED retros are way worth it. Fuckall if I'll ever run a flourescent tube again if I can avoid it. I got the ballast removed ones, they were great.

My problem is I got a 5500W heater and I have no drywall, no insulation and no ceiling. Doesn't do shit obviously.

I'm pretty sure those are at least an OE style HG. May be wrong on that, but they are obviously not "blues" or the likes.

 

[v6buicks]

I was going to proceed with pulling the engine yesterday, but you know how things go with this project....

The hydraulic cylinder on my crane decided to leak all its fluid since the last time I used it. This is really frustrating since I replaced it just a couple years ago, but I can't be mad since it's just another $60 HF unit. I first tried to take it apart and source a name brand seal kit, but removing the main nut seemed impossible, and I wasn't about to spend a week looking at seal part numbers.

I spent a few extra bucks on a whole new cylinder with good reviews on Summit. I wanted one with air actuation, but it didn't seem worth the extra $100. This whole ordeal kinda pissed me off and made me quit for the day. I couldn't seem to win anything except for more messes!

Today I went in with a different attitude. I needed to make progress, and there was plenty of things I could do away from the car. I had everything I needed to start blasting parts, so I figured it was time to get the long awaited blast cabinet online.

The first patient.

All those modifications I did seemed to pay off because this was a breeze even with my severely undersized compressor. I can't wait to blast some more junk that I thought would require replacement.

I believe the next order of business will be to clean a space on my work bench for disassembling, cleaning, and painting cylinder heads. The new hydraulic cylinder and a bunch of other parts should be here tomorrow.