3800 Project: what is it doing? Cavalier L67 swap runs!
- Thread starter Mattstrike
- Start date
I built my welding table from PVC pipe and an aluminum radiator. I also never really use it anymore...
90% of the reason my welds are what they are is because I don't get uncomfortable in awkward positions for welding anymore. I could use a table with a clamp or vice or something similar to hold those awkward pieces steady, just don't have the floor space to setup something like that and learned to be comfortable with no room to move. Being able to see through the cup has been a huge bonus to cramped conditions.
At this point, however, I'm planning to upgrade the MIG for stainless exhaust use and keep the TIG for the more specialized stuff.
90% of the reason my welds are what they are is because I don't get uncomfortable in awkward positions for welding anymore. I could use a table with a clamp or vice or something similar to hold those awkward pieces steady, just don't have the floor space to setup something like that and learned to be comfortable with no room to move. Being able to see through the cup has been a huge bonus to cramped conditions.
At this point, however, I'm planning to upgrade the MIG for stainless exhaust use and keep the TIG for the more specialized stuff.
Got the A/C lines done. As expected, tight fits everywhere. The radiator is as far forward and to the left as it can go without modifying the body or hood latch and crash sensor mounts. This gives a little extra room for the wire harness to pass between the side of the radiator and the frame, as well as simplifies the lower rad hose. I did have to modify the lower mounts of the front support to clear the radiator in the new position.
New A/C manifold; this one is from the '97 Riviera though the same year LeSabre could have worked as well. The hard line side that fits the body are removed and new 90 degree fittings from cold hose crimped on:
Things have to go where there's space. Starting with the suction side, the larger hose goes down and forward then loops back up - this was the path of least tension and still give adequate clearances:
Hard to see since everything is in the way, the left side of this picture is the front of the car. The 90 degree fitting is connected to a straight fitting from cold hose which is crimped to the Cavi body side hose, which goes straight up through the gap where the ICM would have been:
The lighting is off in this picture, so it's hard to see, but the straight fitting is mounted via bracket to the body of the car. The rubber line from the accumulator to the mounted fitting doesn't really move, all of the movement is in the manifold side of the rubber line. Because of how close fitting everything is, that mount point was needed to prevent the hose from rubbing on anything (it has to be clear of the tensioner bracket so the motor can move, so it's right up against the body metal).
Because the radiator and condenser stack are moved, the small line that runs between the condenser and evap core needs to move with it. Body was clearanced as needed, and even though this hose shouldn't move I've added some rubber to the new flange to prevent both sliced tubing as well as sliced fingers. You can see the bracket a little better in this photo too:
The discharge side was a bit easier, since it's a lot smaller. Here you can see the Dorman 800579 tee for the lower hose (stock lower L67 hose cut to fit, and another Dayco e87606 hose with a 5/8 to 3/4 adapter to connect the overflow tank hose. Similar to the suction side, the cold hose adapter connection is mounted to the bracket for the radiator fans, the only part of the line that flexes in on the manifold side of the fittings. This was neccessary for clearance to the headers.
With that done (and the weather a little cooler the next day) I got the welding table out of it's hiding spot:
And now we're on to the rest of the little details to finish off the install. First, new bead roller for tubing, to make the trans cooler lines:
New throttle cable end welded on:
Almost done I think. Have to install the exhaust tips, run some wires for the cutout and accent lights, put the center console and steering column back together, and fluid fill.
New A/C manifold; this one is from the '97 Riviera though the same year LeSabre could have worked as well. The hard line side that fits the body are removed and new 90 degree fittings from cold hose crimped on:
Things have to go where there's space. Starting with the suction side, the larger hose goes down and forward then loops back up - this was the path of least tension and still give adequate clearances:
Hard to see since everything is in the way, the left side of this picture is the front of the car. The 90 degree fitting is connected to a straight fitting from cold hose which is crimped to the Cavi body side hose, which goes straight up through the gap where the ICM would have been:
The lighting is off in this picture, so it's hard to see, but the straight fitting is mounted via bracket to the body of the car. The rubber line from the accumulator to the mounted fitting doesn't really move, all of the movement is in the manifold side of the rubber line. Because of how close fitting everything is, that mount point was needed to prevent the hose from rubbing on anything (it has to be clear of the tensioner bracket so the motor can move, so it's right up against the body metal).
Because the radiator and condenser stack are moved, the small line that runs between the condenser and evap core needs to move with it. Body was clearanced as needed, and even though this hose shouldn't move I've added some rubber to the new flange to prevent both sliced tubing as well as sliced fingers. You can see the bracket a little better in this photo too:
The discharge side was a bit easier, since it's a lot smaller. Here you can see the Dorman 800579 tee for the lower hose (stock lower L67 hose cut to fit, and another Dayco e87606 hose with a 5/8 to 3/4 adapter to connect the overflow tank hose. Similar to the suction side, the cold hose adapter connection is mounted to the bracket for the radiator fans, the only part of the line that flexes in on the manifold side of the fittings. This was neccessary for clearance to the headers.
With that done (and the weather a little cooler the next day) I got the welding table out of it's hiding spot:
And now we're on to the rest of the little details to finish off the install. First, new bead roller for tubing, to make the trans cooler lines:
New throttle cable end welded on:
Almost done I think. Have to install the exhaust tips, run some wires for the cutout and accent lights, put the center console and steering column back together, and fluid fill.
Haha, how did you guess?
Looks like the factory theft deterrent stuff was disabled at some point, at least one wire going to the ignition cylinder is cut. Discovered that when I was asked to install a "kill switch". Looks like it was part of an aftermarket keyless entry/remote start system? Kind of concerning that cutting a few wires is all that would be needed, I thought the pass-key 3 stuff was a little smarter than that, unless it's strictly a BCM thing for this platform where it will tell the PCM "good" regardless? Doesn't bode well for a first start this weekend...
Looks like the factory theft deterrent stuff was disabled at some point, at least one wire going to the ignition cylinder is cut. Discovered that when I was asked to install a "kill switch". Looks like it was part of an aftermarket keyless entry/remote start system? Kind of concerning that cutting a few wires is all that would be needed, I thought the pass-key 3 stuff was a little smarter than that, unless it's strictly a BCM thing for this platform where it will tell the PCM "good" regardless? Doesn't bode well for a first start this weekend...
At the moment, looks like this car is running good, with one exception. The ignition randomly cuts out, tach drops out and it misfires, completely randomly every 10 or 15 seconds. ICM gets power from the OE ICM +12v circuit, plan is to verify voltage at the ICM connector, swap out the ICM just to see, but I'm thinking it's got to be an issue with either the crank sensor or the wire harness to it. I checked the power at each of the battery junctions, not seeing anything randomly dropping out.
I've heat cycled the motor twice now, still chasing some minor leaks (trans cooler line wasn't quite tight enough, etc). Will probably put some gaskets in the exhaust V-bands like I did on the Montana before I do a test drive, also have to adjust the toe since the N-body knuckles are slightly different.
I've heat cycled the motor twice now, still chasing some minor leaks (trans cooler line wasn't quite tight enough, etc). Will probably put some gaskets in the exhaust V-bands like I did on the Montana before I do a test drive, also have to adjust the toe since the N-body knuckles are slightly different.
Look inside the ICM connector and make sure the grommet is a nice rust orange red color. If its green or blue or orange, its probably an aftermarket I see em and i suggest retesting with a an oem icm.
There should be no bcm in that car all pass key functions are controlled by the instrument panel cluster computer
There should be no bcm in that car all pass key functions are controlled by the instrument panel cluster computer
Looks like the aftermarket (new) ICM was the issue, I put in a known working used OE one and it seems to have fixed the issue. Since the ICM came from a running donor I was happily surprised the fix was simple this time.
The 2000 Cav changed to a BCM setup, so everything pass key is handled by the BCM, and communicated via class 2 data to the PCM. The super long story there is it looks like somebody tried to use the working key to send the security system to set a code and bypass the pass key so a remote start could work. Why? I have no idea... However, wiring a '99 regal PCM class 2 network the same way the cav original computer was is working, gauge cluster, BCM, EBTCM, all are fully communicating with the PCM according to the tech 2.
One of the power steering lines has a slight leak, the return line must not like having a filter installed in it. Probably just going to remove the filter and replace the rubber as a precaution, I'm guessing it's just a little too much resistance through it and it's causing the return line to weep at the worm clamp joints. Had it running for about an hour and a half today, drove it over the bumps in the yard at full steering lock just to make sure no axle noised or other issues, as soon as I get the alignment close enough I'll go for an easy test drive and make sure it's ready for Woodward.
The 2000 Cav changed to a BCM setup, so everything pass key is handled by the BCM, and communicated via class 2 data to the PCM. The super long story there is it looks like somebody tried to use the working key to send the security system to set a code and bypass the pass key so a remote start could work. Why? I have no idea... However, wiring a '99 regal PCM class 2 network the same way the cav original computer was is working, gauge cluster, BCM, EBTCM, all are fully communicating with the PCM according to the tech 2.
One of the power steering lines has a slight leak, the return line must not like having a filter installed in it. Probably just going to remove the filter and replace the rubber as a precaution, I'm guessing it's just a little too much resistance through it and it's causing the return line to weep at the worm clamp joints. Had it running for about an hour and a half today, drove it over the bumps in the yard at full steering lock just to make sure no axle noised or other issues, as soon as I get the alignment close enough I'll go for an easy test drive and make sure it's ready for Woodward.
Yeah with how often I've been Chasing Ghosts misfires the icm is the first thing I look at for if it's one of the shity aftermarket ones I've seen three different manufacturers and none of them were as good as the factory junkyard icm's.
There were some workarounds for remote start but keep in mind that all it was is a 50 hertz ground pulsed signal on pin 72 of the PCM blue connector I think I want to say it was the blue connector because I know the wire is dark blue, but its not often shown on most diagrams that you find..... and I can see why since it's fairly easy to defeat
There were some workarounds for remote start but keep in mind that all it was is a 50 hertz ground pulsed signal on pin 72 of the PCM blue connector I think I want to say it was the blue connector because I know the wire is dark blue, but its not often shown on most diagrams that you find..... and I can see why since it's fairly easy to defeat
When Ryan told me that this wasn't yours (I thought it was, so I must've missed that point somewhere...), and told me it was for some nitwit co-worker and you through out the turdy-eight hundy swap, I about fell out of my chair.
Lessons were learned. Hopefully to the benefit of anybody that wants to 3800 swap anything, with unique solutions to the not-well-documented hurdles.
I still remember the first time somebody on an internet forum told me "I xxxx fell out of my chair."
I always wondered, if they could see me now, what would they say?I can't complain about this:
Big brakes looking and working good:
When this is what you see when you get wrect...
Man, what's with that guy? This isn't the first time I've seen him try to take full credit for cars that he had little or nothing to do with. IIRC he tried pulling that nonsense withMan, I didn't really want to do this, I wanted to let this go completely and focus on kids and life and shit.
I fuxked up so hardcore, I can't even...
Oh, shit, I agree!!!!! I have nothing to do with this anymore!!!
Ktj100's twin charge build.The whole "Skinny's Performance" wannabe celebrity bullshit is pretty annoying on its own.
The twin charged LeSabre build was originally Shawn Ramsey, and he does deserve a huge amount of the credit for that.Man, what's with that guy? This isn't the first time I've seen him try to take full credit for cars that he had little or nothing to do with. IIRC he tried pulling that nonsense with
The whole "Skinny's Performance" wannabe celebrity bullshit is pretty annoying on its own.
Sean S. Had been involved with my Park Avenue, before it ever saw a 4T80e transmission. Paul Krok did 90% of the 4T80e swap, then I bought it and got it shifting through all four gears for the first time, got the TCC working, and completed the rest of the tuning so it functioned normally.
Sean never elaborated on what parts of the Park Avenue he actually contributed to.
I'm pretty sure I meant that Skinny's performance fella at the 3800 Gathering.
He had said he had built two of the turbo setups there one of them with a fabricated upper plenum like the older Stattama ones.
He was going nuts about my Crown Royale shifter bag as that is one thing he does all the time I guess?
He had said he had built two of the turbo setups there one of them with a fabricated upper plenum like the older Stattama ones.
He was going nuts about my Crown Royale shifter bag as that is one thing he does all the time I guess?
What group is this in?Man, I didn't really want to do this, I wanted to let this go completely and focus on kids and life and shit.
I fuxked up so hardcore, I can't even...
Oh, shit, I agree!!!!! I have nothing to do with this anymore!!!
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