🔧 BUILD Out with the wife's VW Beetle, in with the all electric VW ID.4 Pro S

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So, the crazy car market moved us to trade in my wife's 2019 Beetle convertible with 24k miles. We bought her Beetle new for $22.5k exactly 2 years ago. We were given $30k in trade value by VW Autobarn who really wanted it, even with damage showing on Carfax. Hard to pass that offer up...

That led us to test drive a couple VW ID.4s, and we found one she liked. Basically, it's a RWD electric with around 250 to 260 miles of range and comes with 3 years of free charging at Electrify America stations, one of which is near where the wife works. It can go from 5% to 80% range in 38 minutes at any of those stations. We'll be adding in a Level 2 Charger at our home soon enough, but can manage with Level 1 slow charging on a regular outlet until then along with the free public charging. My neighbor and her brother are both electricians and can literally hook us up.

If it were me, I would have perhaps ordered the dual motor version for better performance, but that's about 6 to 8 months out if we ordered today, apparently. Not sure we'd get a similar crazy offer for her Beetle next May either. So that was a factor in buying right now.

The Pro S is RWD and has a reasonable-for-the-wife 0 to 60 of about 7.5 seconds. Not a rocket ship, of course. Low center of gravity and weight bias in the rear make it handle well for a crossover, and it should be acceptable in the winter. The Mach E was appealing to me also, but she liked the ID.4 best. We leased, and VW applies the $7500 federal tax credit to the deal. Ford pockets that tax credit if leased. That sways the money numbers heavily in favor of the VW.

The touchscreen controls for most everything get mostly negative feedback in all the reviews. But they are becoming easier to use after a few hours with it. My wife is absolutely smitten with how upscale the interior and exterior is, along with the way it drives and the enormous skylight. I better get rewarded often for this...

Enthusiasts should look elsewhere, or at least wait for the AWD Dual Motor version. But I'm looking forward to seeing how it goes living with an all electric with acceptable range and comfortable driving dynamics and how it works out for an alternative family vehicle. At least I've got the Stinger, Svartpilen and Firehawk to have some fun with if this thing ends up being far too bland. But that'll still probably suit the wife just fine since she cares more about the styling and non-performance aspects of a vehicle.

I'll be learning more about it over the next few days and get some daytime pics soon.

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Bru

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The RWD version has a phenomenal turning circle. It’s like it has drift angle front steering. And one of the only EVs with normal ride quality.

You can’t convince me those controls will ever be normalized. Their operation will change based on temperature, skin moisture, gloves. A full touchscreen is much more consistent.
 

Dave M

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Nice! I’ve really enjoyed the electric life so far, and the level 2 charger is a must if you plan to use it daily. I tried to get by on the level 1 for a few weeks, but letting the car sit and charge for 2 whole days was getting old. I bought my level 2 off of Amazon and I believe I paid $350 for it. I also ran my own 240v circuit to my garage for $150 in materials.
 
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Gone_2022

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He states they applied the credit to the lease.

Looks like in that case the credit goes directly to Ford. I’ve never leased a car so don’t know the ins and outs of that. So at the end of the year he cannot claim the credit, it’s used on this car vs getting a check back at the end of the year you can use on whatever you want or save it
 

Dan00Hawk

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What’s a lease payment on that? Just curious.
For the base model, it starts at $379 for 36 months with $3600 due at signing. But that doesn't include, tax, title, fees, registrations.
We got the higher level Pro S and are at $550/mo for 39 months. It isn't "cheap", but it fits our budget. Of course, you get to eliminate gasoline costs and oil change costs. Also factor in around $1-$2 per day for charging, unless you can take advantage of the free charging network, which we will.

 
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Dan00Hawk

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Nice! It actually resembles the e-Mustang. So, please explain the $7500 tax credit. You get $7500 off on the spot after agreeing to whatever price it cost or do you get it at the end of the year when you file your federal taxes?
Like others said, since we leased, the $7500 comes back to us in the lease terms.

If you buy, it depends on your tax situation. The way I understand it is that if you pay at least $7500 in taxes, you'll receive a full $7500 credit towards that. But if you only pay $2000 in taxes, you only get to claim $2000 of that credit. Everyone says "talk to your tax professional", so that's what I'd recommend too. :ROFLMAO: Since we leased, it took the uncertainty out of that portion of it and we knew we were getting the full $7500 incentive applied to our deal.
 

Gone_2022

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You are correct it’s only a credit not a guaranteed check, so you have to have enough tax liability to cover it.

For these cars that’s normally not an issue. If you don’t pay 7k in taxes a year, (legitimately) you prob shouldn’t be shopping for a 45k or more car.
 
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Dan00Hawk

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The RWD version has a phenomenal turning circle. It’s like it has drift angle front steering. And one of the only EVs with normal ride quality.

You can’t convince me those controls will ever be normalized. Their operation will change based on temperature, skin moisture, gloves. A full touchscreen is much more consistent.
Yes, I was noticing that while parking and doing uturns, and also watching Tanner Foust drift one extensively in winter testing. Not sure I can defeat stability control to do that, and certainly don't need the wife attempting it. :ROFLMAO:

Those controls are certainly an oddity, and probably why the folks that reserved this one didn't buy it. We were able to walk in and buy it without going through the long ordering and reservation process. The controls are a big turn-off for many I'm sure. We'll have to learn more about the voice controls and what they can do as well. I hope VW goes back to at least having some standard buttons and knobs for main controls, and that other manufacturers do the same. But we'll learn to adapt to the system and it's quirks I'm sure.
 

Dan00Hawk

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You are correct it’s only a credit not a guaranteed check, so you have to have enough tax liability to cover it.

For these cars that’s normally not an issue. If you don’t pay 7k in taxes a year, (legitimately) you prob shouldn’t be shopping for a 45k or more car.
Our combined income is around $160k, so we certainly pay enough income taxes through our paychecks. But we also have just enough withheld to get a small refund at the end of the year. I was unsure if we would have needed to adjust our withholdings so that we would theoretically owe around $7500 at the end of the year in order to get the full $7500 credit. Or if we'd still get the full credit of $7500 even if we were still due a refund. That's where the tax guys can clarify the issue. But since we leased, it didn't really matter to us.:)
 

Gone_2022

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Our combined income is around $160k, so we certainly pay enough income taxes through our paychecks. But we also have just enough withheld to get a small refund at the end of the year. I was unsure if we would have needed to adjust our withholdings so that we would theoretically owe around $7500 at the end of the year in order to get the full $7500 credit. Or if we'd still get the full credit of $7500 even if we were still due a refund. That's where the tax guys can clarify the issue. But since we leased, it didn't really matter to us.:)

No you don’t have to adjust anything.

Example: let’s say at the end of the year right now you owe $0 and get $0 for a refund. You would get a check for $7500 dollars.

If you owed $1000 dollars you would get $6500 dollars.

Make sense? It’s all based on your tax bracket on what you “would owe” or your tax liability at the end of the year.
 

Dan00Hawk

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No you don’t have to adjust anything.

Example: let’s say at the end of the year right now you owe $0 and get $0 for a refund. You would get a check for $7500 dollars.

If you owed $1000 dollars you would get $6500 dollars.

Make sense? It’s all based on your tax bracket on what you “would owe” or your tax liability at the end of the year.
Thanks. That makes the most sense, but some of the articles make it confusing. I'll edit my earlier post so I don't contribute to the misconceptions out there. :D
 

Bru

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No you don’t have to adjust anything.

Example: let’s say at the end of the year right now you owe $0 and get $0 for a refund. You would get a check for $7500 dollars.

If you owed $1000 dollars you would get $6500 dollars.

Make sense? It’s all based on your tax bracket on what you “would owe” or your tax liability at the end of the year.

I'm not sure that's true. It's a non-refundable credit, so if you owe $1,000, the credit would pay the $1,000 but you wouldn't get the rest as a refund. BUT, if your withholding matches your tax liability and you owe $0, then you'd get a $7,500 refund, as long as your tax liability was more than $7,500. And if you already get a refund, I think you'd get the $7,500 on top of that.

Tax liability: $20k
Withheld: $20k
Tax credit reduces liability. So $20k-$7,500 = $12,500 tax liability, so if you paid in at $20k, you'd get $7,500 back versus $0 without the credit.
 

Gone_2022

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I'm not sure that's true. It's a non-refundable credit, so if you owe $1,000, the credit would pay the $1,000 but you wouldn't get the rest as a refund. BUT, if your withholding matches your tax liability and you owe $0, then you'd get a $7,500 refund, as long as your tax liability was more than $7,500. And if you already get a refund, I think you'd get the $7,500 on top of that.

Tax liability: $20k
Withheld: $20k
Tax credit reduces liability. So $20k-$7,500 = $12,500 tax liability, so if you paid in at $20k, you'd get $7,500 back versus $0 without the credit.

It’s literally what I just said. Lol. But that’s only if he didn’t apply the credit to the car, so in this instance ford gets the money.


Also yes it would give you the rest. I did that for my teslas. I owed like $2000 dollars, and it paid for that and gave me the rest back via turbo tax as soon as I entered the vehicle credit.
 

Bru

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Also yes it would give you the rest. I did that for my teslas. I owed like $2000 dollars, and it paid for that and gave me the rest back via turbo tax as soon as I entered the vehicle credit.

I think I'm tracking. Amount owed doesn't equal tax liability, so as long as liability is over $7,500 you're good to receive the balance even if you owe.
 
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