Old hp vs new hp


ragingclue

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I was happy to break into the 14s with the old '68 goat I had (Chevy 402... it's all I had and it fit). Was even more ecstatic every time the car actually stopped from relatively high speed without killing me (four drums).
 

Blownbyyou

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Tires/Suspension/gearing/driveline/somewhat of tuning.

Old muscle cars are cool as shit and way more "cool" to drive, but when a 2020 camry can beat a 396 chevelle in almost any category it proves technology is the king not horsepower.......
 

Pressure Ratio

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there are a few cars, that DID run insane speeds like the 427 ZL1 and other specialty engines that GM & Ford snuck out the doors for homologation.
Those cars didn't do any better. They just made more power/torque and spun the tires harder. lol

It's just so fucking assanine to hear old fucks talk about fast cars.... Our old man driver has done 60s chevelle, some 289 ci or something. Sware to fuck its fast:ROFLMAO:

Told him to bring a neck brace in and I'd take him for a ride in the camaro
I am sure some of these cars were way quicker than the 1940's and 1950's car they grew up with. Then the gas shortage & emissions cars with a wheezy 140hp that came after the Muscle car era made those muscle cars seems like beasts as well.

But I think the biggest reason they mistake them for being quick is that they were able to spin the tires at part throttle with being quick. Compared to older cars they were quick. Like White Drake stated, they were sketchy and felt quicker.
 

Pressure Ratio

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70 Buick gs stage 1 :io:
One of my all time favorite cars.

Motor Trend (Janurary 1970) tested a Stage 1 to a 13.38-second ET at 105.50 MPH.

One of the quickest of it's day. But still not very impressive compared to today's cars.

I would still love to own one. haha Heck, I would love a 1969 Buick Riviera GS to go along with it. haha
 

Thirdgen89GTA

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ilikemtb999

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One of my all time favorite cars.

Motor Trend (Janurary 1970) tested a Stage 1 to a 13.38-second ET at 105.50 MPH.

One of the quickest of it's day. But still not very impressive compared to today's cars.

I would still love to own one. haha Heck, I would love a 1969 Buick Riviera GS to go along with it. haha
Turns out 50+ years of tech makes a big difference. Those same engines are out there running single digits now and driving to and from the track still which I find impressive still. The Buick board is full of those guys.
 

Great White Drake

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I’m always impressed by how over built they were. The blocks (BBC,bbf,hemi) can all hold 4 digit hp. Turbo 400’s and big end 9”, 12 bolts and Dana 60’s. Tons of potential and with modern day performance parts, can still hang with modern cars while staying n/a.
 

1quick

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They have the potential to make modern hp out of an old big block but at a pretty high price point
 

Pressure Ratio

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No, some of them were legitamately scarily fast considering tire tech at the time. Bias Ply tires and trapping 116mph sounds scary as hell. Sure 116mph is common today among mass production cars.
That article is for the Corvette that they made 2 of. Not even a car for homologation. The 69 built 1969 Camaro ZL1 didn't run that quick. I believe in 1969 Dick Harrell went like 12.30 or so with cheater slicks. Then like 11.80 with a 850 cfm carb. Then headers, tunnel ram and dual quads he went like 10.80. Then eventually they set a class record at like 9.60-9.70 with a fully built motor and racecar in 1971 or so. Impressive for sure. But a far cry from what the car could do in factory form.

But again, you are talking about a factory-built race engine that they made 71 cars with and something like 80-90 engines in total. I mean they made like 895(ish) of the 1969 Boss 429 Mustangs. And that is considered a rare car.

I love the Factory lightweight race cars from that era. Be it a Max Wedge car, Thunderbolt, or so on. Those are very special cars.
 
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DEEZUZ

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I don't know.. I just look at and see big cam thumping old school muscle cars on the road and think they are all pigs
 

Pressure Ratio

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Turns out 50+ years of tech makes a big difference. Those same engines are out there running single digits now and driving to and from the track still which I find impressive still. The Buick board is full of those guys.
A guy I grew up with runs Buicks in a few cars. He has one of the quickest (quickest at times) 455 based motor. So even the off brand Buick, Olds, and Pontiac motors can make big power like those BBC & Hemi motors. Knowledge and a budget will take you a long way.


I’m always impressed by how over built they were. The blocks (BBC,bbf,hemi) can all hold 4 digit hp. Turbo 400’s and big end 9”, 12 bolts and Dana 60’s. Tons of potential and with modern day performance parts, can still hang with modern cars while staying n/a.
Ya, they built so many stout pieces. Like, designed well over the intended design envelope.


I don't know.. I just look at and see big cam thumping old school muscle cars on the road and think they are all pigs
Some of us were talking about this at the Epic Deli meet. Driving there were passed a cool 1955/56 Chevy. It had the fuel system hanging down, big tires in back, cage, and all that. The plates read "TENS" I believe. But he was doing 35 mph on a 45 mph road where everyone else was going 50 mph. It is a different era car to drive. No doubt about that. Probably best left for cruise nights and trailering to the track.
 

cap42

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Pigs? No slow turds yes.

Remember it's all relative, 14's and 13's were fast back in the 60's 70's for production cars. Hell that was still fast in the 80's and 90's.
 

CMNTMXR57

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Old cars feel faster. That’s it. You’re surrounded by metal and glass while wearing a lap belt. You feel the speed.
I will add, that many of those with Big Blocks, also made their torque at a much lower portion of the RPM band, so that gives the "illusion" that they're stronger/faster/more burly... They pull harder at lower RPM's.

This sort of played out when the LS1 first came out and the LT1 guys always commmented on how their LT1's "felt" faster vs. the new LS motor, but the ET's and MPH on the track and of course the dyno curved proved different. The old school SBC make it's torque much sooner, giving it that feeling of being faster whereas the LS motor built it's mountain in the mid-range and higher.
 

GTPpower

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I went to a Dyno day on Sunday where there were a lot of cool cars. 68-69 road runners, cudas, Camaros. Very clean and nice cars. It was super hot in the shop and DA was about 4300', but the old stuff was in the 200-300whp range. Then, a bolt-on a10 5.0 mustang drives on the Dyno and lays down 440. And a scat pack charger with intransits laid down about 420.
 

Ryan02Stang

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I think when the boomer era starts to die off....the muscle car prices are going to plummet. The majority of car guys I know 40 and under have no desire to ever own a car from before ~1985.
 

ilikemtb999

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I will add, that many of those with Big Blocks, also made their torque at a much lower portion of the RPM band, so that gives the "illusion" that they're stronger/faster/more burly... They pull harder at lower RPM's.

This sort of played out when the LS1 first came out and the LT1 guys always commmented on how their LT1's "felt" faster vs. the new LS motor, but the ET's and MPH on the track and of course the dyno curved proved different. The old school SBC make it's torque much sooner, giving it that feeling of being faster whereas the LS motor built it's mountain in the mid-range and higher.
A friend went from a 97 camaro to a 98 firebird and that’s exactly how it felt. Lt1 felt way quicker but was a 14.0 car bone stock. The ls1 I think ran a 13.6 bone stock but felt slooow
 

N20GT

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And they were steel tanks

Just to add on to this. My 06 Charger with a cam and bolt ons ran high 12's/low 13's on good days. I was in staging lane at GLD and was airing my tires down. Couple of old timers in a 67 Vette with a 427 starting talking shit to me in a fun way. "Hey Dave look at this guy, he really thinks thats gonna help against your vette blah blah blah". Well I gapped the fuck out of him and returned to the staging lanes as they were closing so was gonna hot lap it to get another pass in. These guys came back to the staging lanes and lost their shit, like I really hurt their feelings. Started accusing me of spraying, one guy said "I've driven one of these piece of shits, they arent that fast". I lol and told them its 100% stock, OMG were they pissed. Told them I'd run them again and give the the hit, but lets do it for $100, they werent game.
Old timers really do think their slow ass old cars are fast, it cracks me up. The stories some of them tell at car shows are absurd. Back when cruise nights were a thing it was super common to hear how factory cars from the 60's and early 70's could "pull the tires right off the showroom floor" or something ridiculous like that.
 

SHARKBITEATTACK

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I feel like every time I’ve been to the track, the majority of the fast cars, (sub 10’s) are always modified old school muscle cars
 

Ron Vogel

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A friend went from a 97 camaro to a 98 firebird and that’s exactly how it felt. Lt1 felt way quicker but was a 14.0 car bone stock. The ls1 I think ran a 13.6 bone stock but felt slooow
My dad went from a ‘95 Z28 to a ‘98 TA and we noticed it was much smoother. After I raced his Z28 with my Dakota and beat him he bought the TA...lol
 

Gav'sPurpleZ

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I think when the boomer era starts to die off....the muscle car prices are going to plummet. The majority of car guys I know 40 and under have no desire to ever own a car from before ~1985.
I'm under 40 and would love a classic.
perhaps with some upgrades but if someone tossed the keys to a 1970 chevelle @ me, I wouldnt let them hit the ground
 

stock-t-bird

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but..as an older person.its all we had back then

we dealt with what we had...Speed Shops/Small Dragstrips etc.. you could walk into and buy that Holley carb & be excited! Or the Cragar Wheels/Hooker Headers you saved up for working at some fast food joint at 18.
A sticker/decal made it faster...lmao

ask your Dad

you younger people hate our "old school rock/roll music"...thats what we had back then

maybe,us older guys hate the new shit they play now.which you now you like & we hate..different Generations?

Now,you order online,we were excited to put our hard earned $$ to buy shit & walk in to purchase..we were somebody

Its Old School vs New School ,its simply what you like/want?...New School Wins without a doubt,Technology Wins
but Old School has Chrome/looks/bumper/cam & "the smell"

all is good,just sayin'..give us a break...it was/is fun
 

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