🔧 BUILD LAME Turbo V6 Camaro

General Information

Hello! Welcome to the shit show! I am updating this post in 2021 to explain what new readers are about to witness. If I knew that this thread and build were going to explode into what it is today, I would have started it out a lot different.

This car was (and still is) a basket case. The whole inspiration for starting this project was to start learning how to modify engines in a car that I didn't like. That way, if and when I screwed up, I wouldn't be ruining a nice car. It spiraled out of control from the first moment that I felt boost. I loved what I had created, but it took a ton of work to get to where I was. As soon as I got the car running nicely I was always saying "I'm going to fix______, and THEN I'll just enjoy driving it." You know the drill. Drive, break, fix, repeat! Before I knew it, I enjoyed driving and working on this turd more than the nice car I was trying to preserve!

The point is that the focus of this thread shifts A LOT. To complicate matters, I never have just one ongoing project open at a time. I listed some thread contents with links below. I will update this as new milestones or big updates happen. Just know that even if you click on the shortcut, you may have to scroll past other project posts to reveal the outcome. There are also some mini-projects and very helpful advice from other members in between, so read the whole dang thing if you want!

2018-2019
1. A late introduction
2. Discovering how a PCV works (and plugging it)
3. Custom grill for intercooler
4. Fuel pump trap door
5. Learning that I'll never learn anything from my goofy wide band gauge
6. Deleting AC completely, but retaining heat
2020
7. Low profile heater hose fittings
8. Deleting an air bag without setting a light on the dash
9. Starting a second round of floor repairs
10. ABS delete and line lock installation
- A separate thread for the electrons
11. Installing catch cans with nice brackets (Way overkill)
12. Figuring out the "blow by" problem once and for all (F-body intake plug)
13. Second clutch job, first rear cover job, and preliminary transmission swap research
14. Floors are "done", and Interior is installed.
15. I don't know how to tune, but this wide band might help.
16. Poly trans mount. Yeah, it actually deserves a link.
17. I waved the tuning white flag. Dyno Brian sets me straight!
18. T5 Pro5.0 shifter
19. New shifter was too much fun. OG T5 explodes, and my transmission conversion ideas start to get serious.
-TKX conversion
-TKX swap official write-up
20. Reconfiguring my exhaust for a quieter and less leaky future
21. I'm not done enjoying this car for the year, so I install a $100 T5 instead of a bulletproof conversion. SPOILER ALERT: It only lasts two months.
22. Minor repairs/updates that make the car livable (lighting, stereo, speedometer re-zero, and a clutch master cylinder that actually does it's job!)
23. Wheels and addressing rust again since I got time!
2021
24. Custom center caps
25. 1.9 roller rockers and LS6 springs
26. CAI V2.0
27. TKX is delayed so it's time to address the little annoyances.
-OE pan is junk. Dorman pan gets hot rodded
28. TKX is still delayed, so I install just one poly engine mount and beef up my flimsy turbo drain plumbing
29. TKX does NOT ship the following Monday. Flywheel bolts upgraded to ARP M10 x 1.0
30. When you're on a Chinese garbage budget, you better be ready to work harder. (Oil drain fitting hot rodding)
31. Finally repairing the oil sender pig tail, replacing the other engine mount, and test fitting the TKX.
32. Finally addressing rear brake lines while I wait for more transmission parts.
33. Modifying an ICM for a WOT box
34. Dash gets re-instrumented so that diagnostics become possible.
35. N2MB WOT box
36. Porked crank key. PSA: Be careful installing your balancer!
37. Car runs great after plug change, but the rear main seal needs to be changed again.
38. BURNOUT! Also, I kinda bought a cam.
39. Turbo drain finale (better be) and full exhaust commenced
2022
40. Downpipe V3 and BMR strut tower brace
41. Panhard bar and relocation for bro truck exhaust
42. Muffler, driveshaft, torque arm, and giving up smoking.
43. First trip to the GS Nationals (feat. time slip)
44. The very custom AC project is born
45. New dyno results (up 50 hp!)
46. Exhaust hanger repair before Michigan/S.S. Badger/Wisconsin trip
47. Sizing a better turbo
48. Painting but still not installing the IS3 heads and Monster clutch unboxing
49. Firewall brace
50. New ECM
2023
51. Out of storage and SC engine buy failure #3
52. Modified double roller and spitballing crankcase evac ideas
53. Completing the rear suspension. UMI rear control arms.
54. Cracked headers and L32 swap begins
55. My newest L32 was trash. I'm upgrading the L36 instead
56. Side project: The ultimate-ish intake manifold takes shape


Now back to 2018!
1688935182526.png


Now that this car is running and driving, I figured I would start a thread dedicated to all the questions I’m about to pummel this group with. This is the first time I've really built anything to move quicker than stock, so I'm hoping to learn a lot from you guys before I make unnecessary mistakes. I also have a thread in the Turbobuick.com 3800 section, but I'm not getting as much input there due to a lack of audience. Here goes nothing...

The car I have is a 2002 Camaro with only ONE factory option (rear window defogger). The story supposedly goes that my buddy's dad was looking forever for a new Camaro because he never buys anything for a penny more than the best deal. He almost ran out of time as this was the final model year for the F-body, and '03s were already on the market. The dealer from which he found this car bought it for the sole purpose of being able to advertise "Brand new Camaros for under $10k", so this was the one he took home.

Fast forward to 2018. The car was structurally a wreck from living in the rust belt, but has a great interior, okay black paint, a third pedal, a 3800 (which is a plus in my book), and a lot of sentimental value since I remember riding in it when it was brand new. My buddy’s dad handed me the keys in hopes that I would enjoy it and make it a race car. To be honest, I don’t care for F-bodies, but I couldn't resist this one for the reasons above despite knowing that the floors were in desperate need of existing again.

I already had my dream car which is a 1986 Buick Regal Grand National. As much as I love that car, I like it the way it is in fairly stock form and modifying Buicks has gotten terribly expensive anyway. I figured a black 3800 Camaro could easily fulfill my childhood dreams of racing a badass turbo Buick V6 car while being on a budget, so here I am.

The car is now equipped with:
-6765 ebay turbo
-Precision PW40 wastegate
-Custom turbo exhaust utilizing a stock Camaro and FWD manifolds
-Air to air ebay intercooler
-AEM 50-1200 fuel pump
-Siemens Deka 80# fuel injectors
-Open 3” downpipe
-Custom 3” charge pipes
-Intense mail order tune
-Very ugly but functional upright radiator conversion (the core support was all just rust anyway) :dunno:
-Custom space saving AC delete without bypass pulley
-Midwest Chassis bumper support modified to mount my intercooler
-Spec Stage 1 clutch kit

The car is far from refined and has a lot of little issues to sort out, but I will leave the first post as sort of an introduction to that. I hope you enjoy hearing about it. It’s been fun to build!

Cgge0Pb.jpg


uapwiw2.jpg


08tL6Rj.jpg


7zXNhuZ.jpg


PVLQyzg.jpg

sktchy

⚠️🫠
TCG Premium
Jul 27, 2021
7,499
11,689
Does your timing jump around a bunch at idle? Pull back to like 5 or 6⁰?

I know you said you visually inspected the cam sensor but if it gets worse with a new crank sensor it makes me wonder if that isn't just amplifying another problem and the old sensor gave it some wiggle room?

Also if the cam sensor works with the crank sensor to calculate misfires then does it possibly have an impact on the timing logic? I'm hoping someone more knowledgeable than I am chimes in here but I feel like it'd be worth a shot at changing both. Or a loose connector or pin somewhere maybe. Also can a guy maybe ohm either of those sensors out or read a voltage off of it to see whether it's good or not before just tossing another part at it?
 
  • Like
Reactions: v6buicks

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
Does your timing jump around a bunch at idle? Pull back to like 5 or 6⁰?

I know you said you visually inspected the cam sensor but if it gets worse with a new crank sensor it makes me wonder if that isn't just amplifying another problem and the old sensor gave it some wiggle room?

Also if the cam sensor works with the crank sensor to calculate misfires then does it possibly have an impact on the timing logic? I'm hoping someone more knowledgeable than I am chimes in here but I feel like it'd be worth a shot at changing both. Or a loose connector or pin somewhere maybe. Also can a guy maybe ohm either of those sensors out or read a voltage off of it to see whether it's good or not before just tossing another part at it?
There's no way to ohm them as a "good/bad" test. The best thing to do would be to put a scope on them and find out what they see. I actually have a buddy coming on Sunday who wants to do just that. Until then, I'm probably going to check the sensor and PCM pinouts, ohm the wires for those sensors, shake them around a bit, and hope I find a break.

I bought a cam sensor, but Napa didn't have it in stock. I should be able to get it today. I'm also hoping that I can find those connector bodies laying around so that I can make pig tails.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sktchy

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
Uh oh...
1634817083065.png


The can of worms is now open after realizing how different this harness is compared to the FWD stuff. Before you raise your pitchforks, I think the immediate plan is still to just snip the crank and cam pig tails off and solder in new ones. Before that, I also hope to ohm those circuits out while wiggling wires to see if I can confirm faults. However, just pulling the existing harness this far out made me realize that this entire thing is in pretty rough shape. The split loom pretty much disintegrates if you move it, and the wires under it are not doing much better.

Now it's time for long term ideas because this harness has about returned to ashes. If I can band-aid this one, I'm considering the idea of buying an entire used harness off ebay. There's one that looks pretty nice for $250. I'll strip it down, solder the correct injector clips on it to eliminate adapters, seamlessly add the WOT box wiring, eliminate a bunch of wires that I'm not using (EVAP, AC, EGR, ABS, and DS O2), and possibly lengthen/relocate the ICM pigtail so that the coils can sit somewhere cooler. I never thought I'd consider this sort of job without converting to Holly EFI, but it's neither in the budget nor even a long-term necessity. Am I crazy?
 

sktchy

⚠️🫠
TCG Premium
Jul 27, 2021
7,499
11,689
Your not crazy and I'm planning on going through my harness as well before I'm back together as my plastic is disintegrated as well. If your relocating coils it looked to me the fwd bracket would work real nice to move them up front and I don't think there's really anything in the way other than short wires to stop you from doing so
 

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
Your not crazy and I'm planning on going through my harness as well before I'm back together as my plastic is disintegrated as well. If your relocating coils it looked to me the fwd bracket would work real nice to move them up front and I don't think there's really anything in the way other than short wires to stop you from doing so
I think the FWD brackets would be in the way of the PS reservoir and catch can hose. The only place that really works and gets cooler temps is where the battery tray used to sit. The trouble then is having plug wires that are 5ft or longer. lol I think I'm gonna scratch the ICM relocation. I'm not going to buy another harness either. Buying another 20 year old bundle and modifying it isn't going to make it new again. If I get this one working with the band aids, I'll pull it out and make it nice over the winter.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bs009 and sktchy

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
This was the power wire for both the cam and crank sensors. I know it looks tan or yellow, but 20 years will do that to a white wire. The point is that this part of the harness was not protected by split look and rests against the block. That could certainly cause problems.
1634902386492.png


1634902575204.png


Catching this obvious damage was motivating enough for me to clip, solder new, shrink, re-loom, and reinstall that section of harness right then and there. I only managed one picture of that fun though. It took two tries to get the split loom in the right spots, but it all fits just as well if not better than the factory harness. Here's it is ready to go back in.
1634903113137.png


The car still runs like ass though. :cry:

I have to be in the right vicinity because it doesn't exactly run the same. Each time I fuck with the crank/cam sensors the engine starts and runs a little differently. My motivation ran dry after this fail, but tonight I think I'm going to try making a couple rigs. There's no place to stick my hands in and shake the wires, but I'm hoping to loop some zip ties around the ICM connector wires and play the car like a puppet. If it freaks the hell out, I'll know that that connector is also trash. If it doesn't, then I'll probably get sad and quit for the weekend. replacing that connector will be a job and a half though. That's pretty much a harness out and completely un-loomed job. It's been on and off so many times at this point that the little bolt doesn't really like to go into the ICM anymore. For the record, I can get it tight. It might just be an indicator that the pins are getting weak.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sktchy and GTPpower

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
what a debacle, hate to see this thing giving you so much trouble after all of the trans work you've done

You've checked out the plug wires already right to make sure they're not arcing already too right?
It's a huge pain in my ass.

I've checked the wires, but I don't hear any snaps. One thing I might want to try is clamping the coil side terminals down a bit. They're new, but they've been removed and replace a lot and feel a bit weak at times.... Yeah, I'm definitely gonna look at that a little closer when I get home.
 

sktchy

⚠️🫠
TCG Premium
Jul 27, 2021
7,499
11,689
It wasn't hard too find some of my issues that way. Once I got close to a problem it'd let me know and then when I had a good general idea I killed all the lights and focused on that spot and sure as hell tiny sparks. Even with the lights out they were kinda hard to see but it really helped me alot and unless your hosing down the pcm I don't think your gonna hurt anything doin it
 

sktchy

⚠️🫠
TCG Premium
Jul 27, 2021
7,499
11,689
That looks a little advanced maybe? Somebody correct me if I'm wrong but im pretty sure you want the line right in the bend. What's your wot timing? If it's misfiring there's probably kr happening as well? I hate to wonder if it's the pcm but I've seen where that's a possibility. I've got a spare I could send your way if it's somethin you wanna try
 

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
Sweet Jesus, I found the problem.
PXL_20211031_204012293.jpg


Sooooo yeah. The crank and cam signals WERE fucked up, but not because of electrical faults. I wonder where the the other piece is and how it broke.

It sucks that I have to take the timing cover off again, but I'm happy that I finally know why the balancer installed so sloppily and why the car ran like ass.
 

v6buicks

TCG Elite Member
TCG Premium
Oct 22, 2018
6,259
15,452
Franklin, IN
Real Name
Jon
Looks like the keyway got shaved down?

I had that happen once in my car. Didn't align the balancer perfectly and ran the bolt down and destroyed the keyway. Had to go find a new one and dig out the old one. Huge PITA
Will never do that again now
I about guarantee that's what I did to mine too. I'm not looking forward to the extraction! I do have a good key on my parts block. Hopefully I can remove it without destruction.
 
  • Like
Reactions: sktchy and bs009

Thread Info