🔧 BUILD LAME Turbo V6 Camaro

[v6buicks]

That’s the correct gear lube. You’d need the GM additive if it was limited slip.

I actually went ahead and googled it after I posted. I lucked out! Maybe just maaayyyybee this little peace offering to my 10-bolt will buy me a little extra time. ? I even spent the $3 on a gasket instead of just RTVing the cover back on. I smeared a tiny bit of black RTV on both sides of the gasket, and so far it appears to be staying dry! I thought it was odd that there are also a lot of people who say that the torque spec of 22ft/lbs is to tight. I did that too and feel like I was even close to snapping a bolt.

I also did some investigative work on head gaskets. Most of the folks on Facebook seem to go with MLS and wouldn't worry about getting .020" overbore gaskets. That would have been nice info before I made my ZZP order! Oh well. There are also a bunch of people who have no issues with L67 gaskets and studs. Only one person claims 700+ hp with studs and NA gaskets. He's been in the game a lot longer than I have, but he says a lot of weird shit on there that I tend not to believe. Anyway, who cares? It's Facebook. I can't take any of that to heart without proof or trying stuff myself.

I'm not going to run L36 gaskets. It sounds like it might be okay, but as I said before it's not worth the risk. Thank you guys for liking that post and convincing me to stop being a cheap-ass. lol I went to RockAuto...... just realized that I once again forgot the TCG code... and found the L67 Fel-Pros on closeout! $5 each! Then I went to the Advance Auto website and a couple others to ease my doubts. Apparently only L36 gaskets are directional. Odd. When you buy L67 gaskets, both sides are the same, so after tax and shipping, I got L67 head gaskets for $22. I feel better now.

 

[SinSStr]

I just did a Summit girdle on mine and thought the same with regards to the torque spec. It’s not leaking and the bolts didn’t break so I guess I’m good. Hoping this buys me some time too.

 

[v6buicks]

This car lacks a 1-2 shift. Like I can do it if I'm just pussy footing around, but I WILL grind second if I'm really sending it. This along with my difficulties getting into first from a stop and the growling I hear whenever the transmission is spinning is a clear sign of bad bellhousing alignment. I had some new pins made of the same dimensions I asked for almost a year ago.

Since I had a free weekend, I got to work on it right away...

...and damn do I regret it!

I almost didn't even measure. Why bother, right? It's not like anything should CHANGE, right? These measurements are so messed up that they don't even make sense. It's indicative of a bore that's no longer round.

I tried a few different things which ate up my entire Sunday. It's easy to lose patience getting in and out from under the car, removing and reinstalling the bell, and resetting the indicator just to maybe find a problem that you hardly understand. In the end, nothing worked.

I have only one theory. Remember when I had to beat the crap out of my block to remove offset dowel pins V1.0? I used a grinder to smooth the block out after that, and I may have gone too far. The hole has to be round. There is no play when I install the bell on the trans, and the bore measures exactly the same diameter all the way around. The indicator readings change pretty dramatically when I tighten one bolt even all the others are already torqued. I could screw around with shims, but this is getting to be such a mess, and I clearly don't know what I'm doing....

One time offer. I'm going to start putting this car back together TODAY. However, I will pull the flywheel, pilot bearing, and master cylinder off the car if somebody wants to buy the entire package. TKX, Tilton HTOB, driveshaft, 3rd gen bellhousing, Spec 6 puck clutch, drilled flywheel, ARP bolts (crank drilling required), modified crossmember, Tick master cylinder, custom shifter handle, reverse light harness, and anything else I might be missing. The input bearing still has no noticeable play, and the pilot bearing looks great. Maybe nothing is even wrong and I just hate Tremec transmissions? Idk, but I'm fucking done trying to fix it. Maybe you will have more patience and a wad of cash sitting around. $3800

OR when I get the car back together, and it inevitably starts doing the same shit I'll start taking offers on the whole car. If I'm building an automatic, it isn't going to be for a V6 Camaro.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Did you stick a straight edge to the mating surface to determine this yet?

 

[v6buicks]

Did you stick a straight edge to the mating surface to determine this yet?

To see if the block surface is flat? I haven't yet, but I plan to when I get home.

 

[v6buicks]

I buzzed out the stock dowel pins and pounded the offset dowel pins into block with the eccentric facing almost directly to the right. When I remeasured, it was not in spec but better than the measurements in the last post. After talking with some friends, I feel a little bit better. The growling noise I complain about is apparently very common in all Tremec shit. Hell, I can even hear it even when I'm just spinning the input shaft by hand, but a couple friends with T56s say that they hear the same thing. I'm willing to give up and live with that, but the shifting thing has to be fixed. Once I get this all back together, I'm going to be a lot more picky when I'm bleeding the clutch. Maybe I need to make some adjustments to my pedal? We'll see.

By the way, deal's off. The transmission is back in the car. I didn't do this without making a few small changes though. First, my shifter hole had to change. The jagged edge had torn the dust cover on the shifter. Luckily these are exactly the same on the T5s so I robbed one from there. My modified floor boot was also.... not really doing much.

This is slightly dissatisfying. I really need to tear the carpet out, cut more, and reweld the patch correctly, but this will help keep rocks and crap out for now. I also have a shift boot for a Freightliner on the way from Amazon. It would be nice to keep more of the heat and fumes from making their way inside. Hopefully I measured correctly and can make it work.

I also don't think my custom HTOB locking bolt was helping with the noise situation. It's a drop in the bucket, but I do what I can.

Nice and snug.

I don't have any more pictures so keep looking at the one above for now. See how my custom bolt/union protrudes off the side of the retainer? This is perfectly fine when you insist on installing the bell to the transmission before putting it all in the car. I wanted to try something different so I ground it down flush.

As mentioned, I DID get the transmission back in the car. I did it all on my own without injury too. Not that you didn't already know this, but installing a trans on the bellhousing is a lot easier than trying to install a trans with bell onto the block! I'm probably saving a solid 15 minutes on every transmission install from now on. This was not possible with the T5 and I didn't think it would work with the TKX either, but here we are.

I was very tired from wrestling the TKX again and called it quits around 10:00. I figure about an hour after work today will be all I need before I can start playing with the pedal and bleeding it out again. One new idea that I'm entertaining the most is that the main shifting issue lies in myself.... I don't think I've even attempted a wide open 1-2 shift more than five times. I could just suck at driving. Actually, I KNOW I suck at driving. My feet aren't always working on the same schedule. I've also never found a great seating position that's comfortable while also allowing me to fully depress the clutch pedal. Did I mention I hate F-bodies? I may also just need to find that sweet spot in the gate. Whatever it is, I think I just need to find some open country roads, and grind the fuck out of my second gear synchro a few times. Eventually, I should be able to figure out what the car wants.

 

[bs009]

Is your clutch releasing completely? The TKX is pretty new too so I wonder if you're just one of the first people to actually complain about it.
Hopefully the offset dowels helped

My T56 definitely has a bit of a whine to it when it's spinning and sounds like a bucket of bolts when the engine is warm or when the idle is rough.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Do you have a trans jack? Well worth the bucks if not.

Also, in terms of the HTOB bolt did you look at mcmaster for a shoulder bolt?

 

[v6buicks]

Is your clutch releasing completely? The TKX is pretty new too so I wonder if you're just one of the first people to actually complain about it.
Hopefully the offset dowels helped

My T56 definitely has a bit of a whine to it when it's spinning and sounds like a bucket of bolts when the engine is warm or when the idle is rough.

I thought it was. If it's hanging up, it's not much because the wheels won't move with the car on jack stands, trans in gear, and pedal depressed.

The bucket of bolts thing was extremely alarming the first time I heard it. It was in my frankentrans T5. That was how I learned that the goofy rubber shift handle is what eliminates that noise. Once I went with a solid short shifter the thing was noisy as hell. I almost want to find a way to make one for the TKX. I can't imagine its great for high performance use though.

Do you have a trans jack? Well worth the bucks if not.

Also, in terms of the HTOB bolt did you look at mcmaster for a shoulder bolt?

I actually hate trans jacks when it comes to using one on this car. Neither the T5 nor TKX have flat bottoms, so they don't want to stay upright without help. Plus, the trans jacks can be pretty bulky and my space to work around that and jack stands is very limited. I just have a 2x6 bolted to my regular floor jack. It's much more versatile and the trans does a lot less sliding around on wood vs painted steel. It works really well.

I don't know why I hadn't thought to measure for that while the old one was out. Dang it!

 

[v6buicks]

My back hurts, my legs hurt, my fingers hurt, and I'm very sleepy. All the nuts and bolts are done, but I was limited in my car time yesterday and didn't have time to bleed the clutch. Then I slept through my alarm and got to work late. This car is wrecking me.

But It's Bowling Green or bust! I officially have less than a week to get this turd back on the road and to the GS Nationals. I'm feeling good about it so far.

I really want to make a pass or two down the track this year. It's kind of a bucket list thing. If all goes well with the transmission, I'm left with free time, and the weather holds off I might play around with the boost knob a bit. As long as my AFR looks good and I don't hear any detonation I should be good to go right?


I'm such an idiot. This thing is gonna blow up.

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

If you hear detonation it'll already be too late.

Send it motherfuker

 

[v6buicks]

oh. lol Well I don't have knock sensors, so maybe I'll pass.

 

[sktchy]

Your starting to sound like I did when I let mine drive me mad for a while there. I second the trans jack thing. I'm not sure what that tkx weighs but as many times as I've had the t5 in and out of mine I've found bench pressing the damn thing in and getting a floor jack under it to get the bellhousing bolts in to be about as easy as it gets.

Also after our short conversation about divorcing the torque arm the other day what would you recommend as far as a crossmember with a mount? I've kinda been looking at the bmr since the last time I tightened the top mount bolt to the trans it started feeling a little squishy if you know what I mean. Just not real sure if the t5 and t56 would be the same and you've got alot more experience than I do with the transmission stuff.

And maybe don't push it with the knock especially on e85 until you can have Brian adjust accordingly. Anytime I've played hard enough to set the sensors off on corn the oil has come out sparkly.

 

[v6buicks]

Your starting to sound like I did when I let mine drive me mad for a while there. I second the trans jack thing. I'm not sure what that tkx weighs but as many times as I've had the t5 in and out of mine I've found bench pressing the damn thing in and getting a floor jack under it to get the bellhousing bolts in to be about as easy as it gets.

Also after our short conversation about divorcing the torque arm the other day what would you recommend as far as a crossmember with a mount? I've kinda been looking at the bmr since the last time I tightened the top mount bolt to the trans it started feeling a little squishy if you know what I mean. Just not real sure if the t5 and t56 would be the same and you've got alot more experience than I do with the transmission stuff.

And maybe don't push it with the knock especially on e85 until you can have Brian adjust accordingly. Anytime I've played hard enough to set the sensors off on corn the oil has come out sparkly.

So the trouble with the T5 in the fourth gen is that we are the only two people who give a shit. Nobody makes a crossmember for it. The T56 is way longer so the crossmember won't even come close. I have a 4L60E crossmember in mine because it was the easiest to modify. Since it's just a straight bar across, UMI opted to make it out of square tubing instead of round like the others. Plus, you only have to add a couple inches of material. If you're feeling lucky, I think a TH350 crossmember ends up being close enough that all you have to do is elongate the existing trans mount hole. Don't quote me on it though. Regardless of which brand or style you choose, I strongly recommend doing it. Since you're still in the stock clamshell I assume you still have the stock rubber in their too. When you get the divorced mount and poly bushing you can plant your rear a little more and break stamped torque arms instead.

While I'm here, I need to update you guys. I got the car back together. It was a roller coaster of emotions, but this time it ended on a very high note!

First, I bled the clutch solo. I have a speed bleeder, but it was still probably a funny looking scene. I really wanted to see what was going on this time, so I kneeled on the floor, pumped the pedal with my hand, and cocked my head sideways so that I could see the bubbles coming out of my clear hose. The speed bleeder is great, but I noticed that I created a lot of bubbles if I pumped too fast or opened the bleeder more than about 1/4 turn. I definitely was not that careful last time, so I was very hopeful that I fixed something.

Then I plugged in the battery.

The keys were in my pocket, but as soon as I hooked up the negative, my starter motor started running. Thank god the car was still on jack stands, because that could have been a disaster. Have you ever noticed the locating tang on the 3800's starter power wire ring terminal? Pro tip: if that sucker isn't bent at 90 degrees like it's supposed to, you should consider bending it back. Mine was obtuse, so when I tightened it down the tang slipped and contacted the solenoid power terminal. Don't make that mistake! It might cost you a garage door!

After that little fiasco, I got the car started (when I actually put the key in!) and started hearing not so good noises. There was a loud tick. I popped off my inspection cover and didn't see hoses hitting the pressure plate or anything like that. By the time I had the cover back on, I noticed that the tick was gone. I guess it's fine? ?‍ Then I went for a drive. Keep in mind that this is also the first drive with the snorkel tube removed. I hate the look of the filter sitting right in the middle of my engine bay, but I'm over it. The performance and sound is so worth it! The snorkel didn't exactly look great either anyway. As for the transmission.... I have no friggen idea what I did, but this thing is fixed! It shifts like I would expect a new transmission to shift. WOT from a stop and quickly grabbing 2nd at 5500 is no longer a problem. I didn't take a lot of pictures, but here's a little video of me when I make buttery smooth high RPM shifts. ?


There's only one (sorta) problem. The induction noise and turbo surge is hilariously loud. ? I don't have a console in the car because I'm still trying to come up with a way to seal up the floor. The "remote" handle is making this a pain in my ass. The studs on the TKX shifter stub are too close to the base to get a boot under them. The only way to go above them is to have it pass through the aftermarket handle instead (super high) and leave the adapter/extension exposed to the elements. I'm fine with that, but it requires a huge boot... Amazon sells Freightliner parts.

As goofy as this Devo MF looks, it was almost perfect until I saw where it was going to land on the floor. It was going to run over a couple wire harnesses that would be too much trouble to move. I need something with an offset hole so that it's narrower and away from the dash. This is exactly what I need, but I need it enlarged in all directions about 1".

I never thought I would have this much trouble with something so simple, but I'm glad that it won't keep me from driving the car to Bowling Green. For now, I think I can cut a floor mat to size, cut a hole that's the size of the the shifter's dust cover, and just screw that down for noise, heat, and fume reflection. It would be much better than what I had before, and hold me over until I feel like ripping the whole carpet out again to do this correctly.

 

[sktchy]

Thanks for the insight. Glad I asked before I pulled the trigger and hated myself for having to fight with it.

I like the floor mat idea. May have to borrow that unless I can find the good shift boot I have somewhere. Think I'm still leaning towards ditching the t5 and just putting the 60e with s10 stall in. But I also dont plan on trying to put power down so much as I just want stuff to work without issues and the wiring will hold me back more than anything.

Great work though man, headaches aside its good to see this thing drivin and you havin some fun with it.

 

[v6buicks]

Thanks for the insight. Glad I asked before I pulled the trigger and hated myself for having to fight with it.

I like the floor mat idea. May have to borrow that unless I can find the good shift boot I have somewhere. Think I'm still leaning towards ditching the t5 and just putting the 60e with s10 stall in. But I also dont plan on trying to put power down so much as I just want stuff to work without issues and the wiring will hold me back more than anything.

Great work though man, headaches aside its good to see this thing drivin and you havin some fun with it.

I'm always happy to help! I'd be torn in your situation as well. I'm not sure what I would do if I had to do it all again. First of all, I would have gotten the G-body I always wanted, but the transmission debacle isn't as easy for us RWD guys as I first envisioned. Then there's all the little shit that will nickle, dime, and labor you to death. Now that I finally have this thing figured out, I'm glad I stuck with the stick. I think it adds a lot of much needed cool factor to the LAME V6. I just would have gone with a T56 knowing what I know now. 4L80E is probably the choice I would have made if I was still wanting to stick with the budget.

Thanks! I can't wait to show it off some this summer. Me being me, I'm also very excited to finally turn up the heat. I can't believe that I managed to hold off doing any more engine performance mods to this thing for two whole years! I kinda salivate every time I walk past my cam swap parts shelf.

I am thinking about bringing the car to "the gathering" because of the push from some people. It just seems like a long drive by myself to hang out in a park with a bunch of people I've never met before. No offense, but most of the cars I've seen in the event pictures look kinda uninteresting. We'll see. If anything, it would be pretty cool to make a pilgrimage to Flint and take some pictures at some points of Buick interest.

 

[GTPpower]

That's my thoughts on the gathering as well. There are maybe 3 cars there I would like to see, after that it just seems really boring.

If they would rent a track for a day, I'd be all over that.

 

[v6buicks]

That's my thoughts on the gathering as well. There are maybe 3 cars there I would like to see, after that it just seems really boring.

If they would rent a track for a day, I'd be all over that.

100% agreed. We can still do the car show too, but let's line them up!

 

[sktchy]

I think if I ever got serious enough with it to do something transmission wise I'd probably just get the adapter stuff and throw a th350 behind it. I wouldn't have bothered with the cam swap and such if it wasn't for being on my last resort engine wise and just throwing together what was left from thinking I could do something with it. If I had to do it all over again I'd have left it at 10 lbs (which I plan to do anyway this time around) and been happy with daily driveable 300 whp other than there was so much other stuff wrong with it it wouldn't have probably ended well anyway. Nevertheless I should probably change the oil put the exhaust on and sort out the nuances in the fueling and at least try and enjoy it while it lasts until I get to a place where I can and want to throw a little money at it again.

I guess I'm not sure what gathering you guys are talking about but it sounds like somethin I'd have to trailer my junk to anyway lol

 

[v6buicks]

10th annual W-body, 3800, Holden, G8, fuckitbringwhateveryouwant Gathering in Michigan.

 

[sktchy]

Sounds like a fun time. I think if I ever got to a point where I'd trust it on a long journey id rather find a spot to have a beer with you guys tho ?

 

[GTPpower]

I'd definitely just trailer mine.

I wish zzp would do a track event or even a Dyno day.

 

[v6buicks]

Part of the gathering is going to Twin Peaks. lol Turbocharged400sbc mentioned he was interested in going and dezldave is nudging me to go. Idk. We'll see. I'm already wanting to take the car to MI for other reasons in August. If I decide to go, I might just cruise up in the GN and enjoy my AC. Apparently they have an LC2 class.

ZZP did a 3800 dyno day right before the pandemic which looked pretty successful. I don't think they've done any since though. Maybe they'll bring it back.

 

[sktchy]

I mean, we can do one of those days whenever it just won't be as cool as if zzp did it

 

[v6buicks]

I mean, we can do one of those days whenever it just won't be as cool as if zzp did it

SHEEEEEEEEEEIT!! You're right! Party at Brad's barn.