🔧 BUILD LAME Turbo V6 Camaro

[v6buicks]

Whoa. Fab work. Daddy likes.

I'm kinda over the mess, but I like the results. lol

Every time I dive into this sort of work, I cuss mostly at my welder. I've made some changes like buying the correct wire size for my feed and learning more about how to get my settings right, but there's only so much you can do when you have switches instead of dials. I really need a multi-process machine, a good work space, and a couple more tools for fitment like a band saw and belt sander. I just don't have the space to home it all. Again, oh well! I suppose I'm still impressed with how much I've managed to produce in a 19x22 garage.

 

[v6buicks]

I busted ass today. Welding started off good, but ended up being very frustrating by the end. I wonder if something is wrong with my set-up because I have terrible porosity and I have to clean my tip and nozzle every 5 minutes.

Anyway, I decided to get away from the cheap mild steel v-bands. I got a stainless Mishimoto clamp and I have another on the way. These are so much nicer and I think they'll stay that way for a long time.

There will be no problem getting a socket onto #6 like I anticipated.

I'm really hoping to use as much scraps as I can before buying more 3" pipes, so I'm making some minor tweaks like this to fit pieces that I already have. I ended up partially cutting the pipe six times and bending it to the exact angle I needed to mate up with the custom intermediate pipe.

Can you tell that the intermediate pipe is a huge uncut section of downpipe 2.0? I have an 02 bung plug on the way along with the second v-band I mentioned. It will go between the down pipe and intermediate pipe so that everything can be easily removed. The black section will have a tweaked 45 welded to it at the end with another tweaked 45 welded to that and finally an adapter welded on which will be band clamped to the hawks system. I like this kind of work, but I'm also really glad that I'm not building an entire custom exhaust like many friends wanted me to try.

I don't think I've ever used seven jack stands on one car. lol

It's looking like the real deal! I thought that V-band would be less conspicuous, but I'm not bothered by it. I was really tempted to shoot the finished section with paint so that I could start wrapping it, but I couldn't remove it without disrupting my temporary fitment of the intermediate pipe. Since the second section of the DP is only going to be held on by the pipes it's connected to, I really just need to take this one step at a time. I can probably get going on connecting the two 45s on the intermediate pipe and the custom hanger tomorrow. I also have some more supplies for the drive shaft loop once the jack stand jungle gym can be removed.

Also, it looks naked without the tower bar now. I can't wait to throw that thing back on!

 

[GTPpower]

That looks awesome!

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

Trial and error cutting and Welding of stainless 3 in mandrel bent pipes to make a custom exhaust is overrated. Takes a ton of time. But in the end is really nice especially when you consider how much the aftermarket exhaust would cost for a Cressida / ae86 Toyota chassis...

That shi looks fantastic dude

 

[v6buicks]

Thanks guys! I'm so excited to hear this thing roar again. I'm glad that my parts shipped from Summit ultra quick and via FedEx this time so that I'm not delayed by Sunday and Presidents Day. The V-band and bung plug should be here when I get home from work. If I continue to bust ass I should at least be able to rev it in the garage tonight. I still haven't put any RTV around my oil pan though, so I plan to take care of that first before going for a drive.

I got a little more done yesterday. I'm waiting to weld the straight section of the intermediate pipe to the S until I'm sure that it's going to fit right with the V-band attached. The rest of it is pretty much done though. The beauty of the adapter and band clamp is that they're a lot more forgiving in terms of fitment. Once I have everything in their final homes, I'll finish making the front hanger.

Because I had to pull it off to weld the O2 bung anyway, I decided to shoot a little exhaust paint on the down pipe and refit the tower bar. I haven't been this excited about changes under the hood in a long time. This looks a billion times better. Everything finally looks relatively tied together and natural.

Since I was motivated but unable to continue exhaust work I shifted back to the driveshaft loop. I'm not as excited about this, but I'll definitely be happy to cross it off the list. I fit all the pieces close enough to get an idea of where the frame holes needed to go. The driveshaft loop/frame brace has long slots, so I shouldn't really even need to be close here. lol

This is going to be it until I can finish the exhaust and clean the garage though. Unfortunately, I have to remove the driver seat, and pound a part of the floor back into it's normal shape. I don't really know how or why it got dented, but it probably just happened at some point during the floor repair process. After that, I should be ready to buzz this piece in and move on to the passenger side.

 

[v6buicks]

I know I'm making a lot of posts about a very simple thing, but I'm too amped to not.

It's hard to tell from the video of course but this is a huge improvement even without a muffler. So many of the ugly drones and other awful open dp V6 sounds are gone. Of course pointing it OUT the garage as opposed to the floor under the car makes it sound a lot quieter too.

Wife is happy. She said she heard me start the car but it didn't knock any pictures off the wall this time. ?

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Phenomenal and better looking than any I have done.

Also, I fuckin hate welding under cars.

 

[v6buicks]

Phenomenal and better looking than any I have done.

Also, I fuckin hate welding under cars.

Thanks!

I always wonder if a lift would make it better.... I'm guessing yes, but only because I can dance and run around like an idiot when molten slag inevitably gets stuck in my boot or shirt.

 

[v6buicks]

Smokey gonna smoke.

I got under the car to take a look at that leak again and failed to remember that there really isn't any room to smear rtv along the pan rail unless I pull the engine. The mount bracket is in the way. ? This means that doing it right is my only option. Are there any recommendations for gasket brands or techniques for making this sum bitch seal? I think I've used a Fel-Pro gasket/windage tray and just bolted it up there. Should I add a light coating of RTV? Which color? I'm open for anything, but I'm tired of wasting oil. I might even try to catch it in a clean container this time and reuse it.

Edit: I googled it. All the old forum posts seem to agree that a relatively thick bead of RTV goes on both sides of the gasket. Some say that it's even per GMs procedure. Oops. In that case, can I just reuse my old one? Those things aren't exactly cheap.

Another edit: Is the GM sealant (12346141) similar enough to Permatex aviation form-a-gasket? My variety of sealants is becoming more of an overwhelming hoard than a helpful collection. lol

 

[bs009]

I've been noticing that almost every junkyard engine I've seen has been wet by the oil pan gasket so I'm at the point where I was just planning on using RTV there.
Good to know that dealers do that too, seems silly to use RTV and a gasket as a GM procedure but I guess there must be something about that surface that makes it difficult to seal

 

[v6buicks]

I've been noticing that almost every junkyard engine I've seen has been wet by the oil pan gasket so I'm at the point where I was just planning on using RTV there.
Good to know that dealers do that too, seems silly to use RTV and a gasket as a GM procedure but I guess there must be something about that surface that makes it difficult to seal

The only reason I give the gasket a pass is because of it doubling as a windage tray. Otherwise, I agree that the whole idea of having a gasket is dumb. Lol

 

[GTPpower]

Yeah, I always rtv them.

 

[v6buicks]

Well I'm back. For now. I let this thread sit for a couple month, but the car? Not so much.

It seems that the last time I posted, I was dealing with an oil leak. Let me spare you the drama and give you only the facts. After shitting all over Dorman pan flanges and the goofy gasket design, neither one of those ended up being the issue. I replaced the gasket with RTV on both sides, and it leaked just as bad in the same exact spot. I was so angry about it that I rage bought a very pretty part in hopes of making any future pan swaps a lot easier.

Don't get me wrong, I'm super happy that I have this work of art from Spohn. Freeing up all that weight and space is going to be sick, but it was also a very impulsive and out of order. Before this even arrived I leveled my head a bit, and came up with an idea for finding and fixing the oil leak without even needing to remove the pan. I put the leak in reverse, Tere.

The nice part about the blocked PCV is that I can do this. I hooked the vacuum pump up to me catch can fitting, sucked the crank case down, and listened for hissing. Finally, the leak made itself obvious. My weld at the very top of the turbo drain fitting was not complete which is something I should have seen coming. I shoved an embarrassing amount of RTV up there with my finger, and waited for the vacuum to works its magic. It got sucked in there a bit and the leak was gone. Someday, when I have another reason to be in there, I'll replace the pan with a better placed and welded fitting. I have a nice OE pan ready to go, but that too is going to wait a while. I'm too happy about smoke and stink-free Camaro rides!



Or at least I was for about 15 minutes...

Remember that sweet exhaust that I called a "huge improvement". It wasn't. Holy shit. We've all heard awful GM V6 with no muffler noises. Mine was that but basically with a trombone bell on the end. All the noises that sorta resembled something cool were gone, and all the worst noises that everyone hates were amplified. I literally took one drive and was ready to put the car up for sale. I had never been so degusted by a car or so embarrassed to be in one. You know me though. I don't give up on this thing. I decided to throw my wallet at it. If it fixed it, sick. If not, I was truly going to have to reevaluate my future with 3800s.

Summit had a Magnaflow straight-through muffler of very similar dimensions to my Hawks test pipe. I crossed my fingers and took the plunge. I was skeptical that a 4" muffler of this style could do a whole lot, but it can't cost over $300, have great reviews, and do nothing right?

Hot damn. That's a billion times better! That was so worth the money, and I'm back in love with the car. All the obnoxious decel moo mang shit is gone, I can listen to the radio at normal levels, and it sounds pretty aggressive when I lay into the throttle. No regrets.

Once again "Sweet! I'm done. i'M nOt GOnNa wOrK oN iT aNymOre. i'M jUsT gOnNa dRiVe iT!"

So I just left Discount Tire right? I got brand new Nitto NT555 G2s in hopes of solving the vibration problems. It helped. The old Khumos were done many years ago, but I still had a violent vibration at 70mph that got even worse the fast I went. I knew what it had to be, and I couldn't let it go. The driveshaft is too short, out of balance, and angled improperly. I had been dreading this day for some reason, but I was ready to rip off the band aid. I started by gathering all my scrap 2x4s and building some log cabins.

Then I searched for driveshaft shops. Anybody been down this road recently? Custom driveshafts on driveshaftshop.com are like $800 with an 8-10 week lead time. That's a hell no for me. I did find this local place with good reviews and no website though. I called them up and they said it was same day turnaround if I provide a yoke. I said "sign me up!" I gave them my seal to center measurement and got a custom 3" steel driveshaft with 1350 ends in three hours. Best of all, it only cost me $300.

But I couldn't install a brand new shaft with new u-joints at messed up angles. I was prepared.

I used the angle finder on my phone to set everything up. My pinion is angled 2.1 degrees down from my crank.

and that is definitely up there as being one of the best mods I've ever done. The flexible stamped torque arm is only cool for making every WOT feel super violent. The new torque arm tamed the car so much. It hooks and books with no stupid vibrations or wheel hop. Suddenly 330whp feels as weak as it should. The 10-bolt was in trouble a long time ago. Now, it's endangered.

I'm have nothing planned immediately, but I'm selling my DHP. I never got it to work with my unsupported ECM, I plan to go with Holley EFI some day anyway, and I have a motivated buyer. I think that money from DHP can be better spent on lifters since I'll have Dyno Brian tune this thing again when I swap in the ST5. I'm not doing that for a while though. I've been having a great time just driving this thing to local meets and cruising with friends. I plan to take this instead of the GN to the GS Nationals this May as well. The boomers will be upset to see a Chevy at the Buick event, but we can't all drop 50k+ on a 10 second GN. 3800 is is like the sloppy LS swap of Buick engines IMO. Some people will be happy to see it.

 

[GTPpower]

What are you going to do for a rear end when yours pops?

Glad to see an update. I was wondering if you've been doing any work.

 

[v6buicks]

What are you going to do for a rear end when yours pops?

Glad to see an update. I was wondering if you've been doing any work.

Needed a TCG break. I caught myself spending way too much time on my phone, so after weaning myself off, I might just stick to the 3800 discussions. lol

I currently have my eyes on the Quick Performance 9". It should be a mostly bolt-in affair good for 800+ and can come powder coated for under $3k. I was interested in the Strange S60 for a while because it was designed for F-bodies in mind. Then I found out that they actually fit very poorly with stock style suspension parts and still won't hold nearly as much power as a 9". That's out. It sounds like I should be able to put a factory housing 9" in with my UMI panhard bars and torque arm which is my main concern. I don't want to have to buy oddly bent linkages that only come with heim joints.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

I would rather have a 9 for a boosted car 60s get into weird splits with tall gears.

To elaborate you have 3.54 or higher numerical gears only unless you get a dana 61 which is obviously not the Strange setup.

A 9 will do 2.42 or so to over 6.x if not 7.x if you wanted to for some reason.

 

[sktchy]

Needed a TCG break. I caught myself spending way too much time on my phone, so after weaning myself off, I might just stick to the 3800 discussions. lol

Feel this.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

Also without the violence due to your suspension upgrade the 10 bolt may do better than you think.

I suspect wheel hop killed a lot of them too tbh.

On another topic I had thought for a log time Buick should have gotten an fbody in compensation for the loss of the gbody. That is sort of a rant but imagine the tta being developed until say 2002 even. What a strange world it would have been.

 

[v6buicks]

Also without the violence due to your suspension upgrade the 10 bolt may do better than you think.

I suspect wheel hop killed a lot of them too tbh.

On another topic I had thought for a log time Buick should have gotten an fbody in compensation for the loss of the gbody. That is sort of a rant but imagine the tta being developed until say 2002 even. What a strange world it would have been.

You might be on to something there. Right now I can launch incredibly hard, but the rapid loading and unloading could have been a lot worse for it. I just hope it lasts the year. I want to get to this fall and start beating the shit out of it. lol

That would've been cool. I'm on the lame train with that topic though. I'm glad the GN died in '87. Yeah, I said it! The car was axed forever on its highest and most influential point, We saw it rise and never had to watch go through it's shitty era like we did with all the muscle cars. The W-body was the replacement, but it was so different that I don't really see it as the successor if that makes any sense. Then in the grand scheme of thing, you have to realize that the W-body was a far quieter, smoother, more reliable, and higher quality car than than the G-body which was virtually unchanged since it was released as the A-body in the 60s. They aren't a suitable GN replacement but a great G-body replacement.

GM was at a time where the separation of Chevy, B, O, P, C, and GMC from each other or GM as a whole was closing up. THAT was not managed very well and essentially resulted in the bailout, but that's neither here nor there. I like to think that the '89 TTA was a direct result of that migration and more than any enthusiast could have expected. They put a loved Buick engine which was already a couple years out of production in a loved Pontiac, and the result was glorious. To be fair Buick tried like hell to make some cool AF performance cars in the late 80s, but couldn't develop a transaxle that could handle all that through the warranty period. Not to mention that some of the ideas would continue to rival the Corvette which was a whole other goofy (awesome) problem. Among others there were turbo LeSabre T-types, RWD turbo Reattas, roots blown 3.8s (non-3800), and even a turbo V6 Electra Estate wagon rolling around Detroit. I can only imagine how different Buick would be as a brand today if all that made it into production. I think we would basically have cheaper Buick CTS-Vs and Cadillac Enclaves with better build quality and materials.

I'm gonna stop rambling before I cream myself.

 

[sktchy]

Don't forget the early grand prixs with the McLaren turbos

 

[v6buicks]

Don't forget the early grand prixs with the McLaren turbos

Sadly those were the best they could do. 3.8 made too much torque. Those 3.1 turbos are cool in their own right, but they were slugs by comparison. The car that surrounded it didn't help the experience. The ABS powermaster brakes were a nightmare, inverted rear leaf spring was blah, and that package wans't cheap!

 

[sktchy]

It was an attempt I suppose. I know where there's a couple sittin but I wouldnt touch em with a stolen dick ?

 

[Turbocharged400sbc]

First gen W bodies are the best gen W bodies

 

[v6buicks]

On topic:
I sold my DHP for significantly more than I paid. Nobody was able or willing to share the voodoo magic required to crack my Camaro file. Even if I had the help, I'm not sure if I would understand it over the internet. She gone. I still have HP, but I see myself getting a Holley system before I ever try messing with another stock system.

I bought lifters and head gaskets. That means the only parts left to buy for my cam swap are an upper intake gasket set, dyno time, and pushrods which will have to wait until I can measure. Regardless, I still have no plans to do this any time soon. I'm trying to preserve the rear end for a while and fix some underlying issues...

Such as my transmission. I need to update my manual because the stock driveshaft was obviously a bust. I'm discovering that the offset dowel pins are pretty critical as well. I could have my machinist buddy whip these up for me in a day, but I really don't want to ask him to do a free job twice. I'm heavily considering buying a mini-lathe and making some myself. It's just going to be expensive and incredibly time consuming since I'll have to learn everything on my own. I've been considering this for a while anyway and I think it would be a great way to dip into some machining.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

get a 4 jaw chuck and oversized stock. look up sfpm calculatiins and set your rpm there. Use insert tooling, watch a few yt vids and go for it. You will be surprised its not bad in this Case.

This Old Tony and mrpete222 are good channels for that and there is an old south bend book called how to run a lathe or similar.

Turn your first part down so it is offset in the chuck, center the stock, do your non offset end then saw or part it off. By using a dial indicator to set up you should be able to get it.

If my shit weren't probably months out from being set up I would probably turn you a couple.

How offset are your pins btw?