BMWs with the TT V8 need new batteries every 10,000 miles
- Thread starter Mook
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You could end up paying for the car all over again just in repairs if you get a real bad one. rofl. Just got the chance to see a claim for a cylinder head on a 5 series? I think or a 7 I cant remember.... either way the labor alone was 38 hours and the claim total tipped just over 17 grand. Rofl shit boxes
i find it very hard to believe some engineer with an electrical degree cant figure out how to regulate the charging system so it doesnt nuke batteries. LOL the article has it spot on though, masking the issues is the ONLY option because actually fixing it would have a domino effect in other areas as in the epa mpg rating for example.
classic exercise in what looks good on paper doesnt work worth a fvck in reality way to go BMW.
classic exercise in what looks good on paper doesnt work worth a fvck in reality way to go BMW.
I wonder how common this problem is because I've literally never heard of it and I've researched the 550i and 750 extensively. I almost leased a 550 over the 535 and for probably 3 years I tossed about the idea of buying a used 750. I've never seen any mention of the battery issue, let alone one where it needs to be replaced every 10k. There are other issues with the N63 engine but that's one I never heard of.
Either way, that's a wacky problem. I hope they're not making their customers pay for the batteries.
Also, to be fair, BMW has had a pretty good track record of retroactively fixing problems that they were under no obligation to fix. The twin turbo inline 6's for instance. When they first came out all of their fuel pumps were failing. BMW's solution was to warranty them until 125,000 miles so that nobody would ever realistically have to worry about replacing one. They revised them and the problem disappeared. The only people you see mention fuel pump failures are those that talk about how horrible they've heard the 335's are with fuel pumps but in the community you no longer see failures.
Same with the turbos. The wastegates would rattle on some cars. BMW replaced the turbos and upped the turbo warranty to 83,000 miles on all N54s.
And finally, with the twin turbo N63 that this article references BMW just came out with a program that will update and fix a bunch of potential failure points on your N63 car regardless of whether or not it's in warranty. And we're talking big stuff like injectors, the timing chain, timing chain tensioners, Battery, Crankcase Vent, fuel pressure sensor, vacuum pump, etc. And if you just want to shake your fist and the car and tell it to get bent BMW will buy it back from you and give you a discount on a new one. They take care of their customers when they fuck up. You have to give them that. Long term though, any car that requires a battery every 10k is going to take a serious hit in second hand value which seems like a whole different problem they're going to need to address. Another checkmark for leasing here...
It's the best of a bad situation and a lot of good will where none is required.
As far as owning one of these out of warranty, I think my e60 is the last BMW I would comfortably own out of warranty. The A8 really soured me on high tech, high end cars and as I type this the BMW is at the dealer $2000 deep in the diagnosis of a knocking noise that's so far seen the replacement of the AC compressor and two tensioner pulleys.
Either way, that's a wacky problem. I hope they're not making their customers pay for the batteries.
Also, to be fair, BMW has had a pretty good track record of retroactively fixing problems that they were under no obligation to fix. The twin turbo inline 6's for instance. When they first came out all of their fuel pumps were failing. BMW's solution was to warranty them until 125,000 miles so that nobody would ever realistically have to worry about replacing one. They revised them and the problem disappeared. The only people you see mention fuel pump failures are those that talk about how horrible they've heard the 335's are with fuel pumps but in the community you no longer see failures.
Same with the turbos. The wastegates would rattle on some cars. BMW replaced the turbos and upped the turbo warranty to 83,000 miles on all N54s.
And finally, with the twin turbo N63 that this article references BMW just came out with a program that will update and fix a bunch of potential failure points on your N63 car regardless of whether or not it's in warranty. And we're talking big stuff like injectors, the timing chain, timing chain tensioners, Battery, Crankcase Vent, fuel pressure sensor, vacuum pump, etc. And if you just want to shake your fist and the car and tell it to get bent BMW will buy it back from you and give you a discount on a new one. They take care of their customers when they fuck up. You have to give them that. Long term though, any car that requires a battery every 10k is going to take a serious hit in second hand value which seems like a whole different problem they're going to need to address. Another checkmark for leasing here...
It's the best of a bad situation and a lot of good will where none is required.
As far as owning one of these out of warranty, I think my e60 is the last BMW I would comfortably own out of warranty. The A8 really soured me on high tech, high end cars and as I type this the BMW is at the dealer $2000 deep in the diagnosis of a knocking noise that's so far seen the replacement of the AC compressor and two tensioner pulleys.
Im on the opposite end opinion wise from you. I think goodwill is absolutely required in these cases. If you have identified a known major issue or high failure rate it is common to see a special coverage or extended warranty on that part. Here at GM water pumps on cruze's, enclaves, acadia's etc are extended beyond factory coverage. Because there is a known issue with those parts. Same thing with timing chains being stretched on certain models etc.
As BMW you are marketing a higher end vehicle than what GM offers. So if you sold me a vehicle for 90k and it was found that the fuel pumps consistantly went out due to poor design, but because I was out of your weak 4 year 50k warranty I had to pay for it I would tell you to pound sand, and I would happily take my money to Audi, Lexus, etc...
Same thing with the battery issue. I believe in the article it is being taken care of by BMW for those customers. And that is a must! You cannot tell a consumer to pay for a battery every oil change. If they did not cover issues like this they would lose the majority of their customers.
If that makes sense
Oh I agree. It's required but still rare. Most companies don't do it, domestic, German, Japanese, etc. I can make a list of well documented common failure points in the GM cars we work on and they are all but ignored. Same goes for Audi that I'm aware of. The transmission in the Ford Taurus was basically junk from 1986 - 2000 and Ford just said nope, not a problem. It is the right thing to do but it's also the rare thing to do.
I'll take reasons I didn't buy another A8 for $500 Alex.
Totally agree and they are going to get the shaft on resale value.
Let me see if I understand this.
BMW in its quest for as much MPG as possible, set the charging systems to turn off unless the car is coasting. This results in the batteries roller coastering their charging cycles. They goes up. They comes down. Too much, too far, too fast. BMW is not willing to change the coding for their charging systems because fixing the charging problem by doing so would open them up to lawsuits for exaggerated fuel economy numbers.
So, instead, BMW will let the batteries fail within 10,000 miles? Isn't this also a liability issue? If the batteries are failing, doesn't this result in the complicated electronics systems not getting the steady current they require? An old school way of determining a battery is failing is the electrical components start acting up. Lights, radio, etc. start misbehaving because of the lack of power. If BMW's batteries are repeatedly failing, is this going to negatively affect the electronics in these cars? Resale value on these vehicles could plummet if the electronics start having problems after several battery replacements.
Maybe BMW could offer owners the option of re-calibrating the the charging system with the understanding this may affect mileage? Most Ultimate Driving Machine owners would probably sign a release in a second and get the charging system straightened out rather than let it fail... and fail... and fail.
BMW in its quest for as much MPG as possible, set the charging systems to turn off unless the car is coasting. This results in the batteries roller coastering their charging cycles. They goes up. They comes down. Too much, too far, too fast. BMW is not willing to change the coding for their charging systems because fixing the charging problem by doing so would open them up to lawsuits for exaggerated fuel economy numbers.
So, instead, BMW will let the batteries fail within 10,000 miles? Isn't this also a liability issue? If the batteries are failing, doesn't this result in the complicated electronics systems not getting the steady current they require? An old school way of determining a battery is failing is the electrical components start acting up. Lights, radio, etc. start misbehaving because of the lack of power. If BMW's batteries are repeatedly failing, is this going to negatively affect the electronics in these cars? Resale value on these vehicles could plummet if the electronics start having problems after several battery replacements.
Maybe BMW could offer owners the option of re-calibrating the the charging system with the understanding this may affect mileage? Most Ultimate Driving Machine owners would probably sign a release in a second and get the charging system straightened out rather than let it fail... and fail... and fail.
See that's the thing. There's a bunch of complaints about the N63 engine, most of which BMW is retroactively fixing but there's no complaints about batteries failing every year. I just did a google search for common 550 problems (the same search I would have done when I was interested in buying one) and no dice. The same goes with specifically searching for battery issues. I can find something here and there about a failing battery but nothing about chronic charging issues or needing to be regularly replaced.
Something's a little dicey here.
"The value of these cars is going to drop like a rock once they’re out of warranty. AGM batteries, especially those branded by BMW, are probably going to cost $400 - $700 to change out, since they need a factory “reflash” to the computer. Yes kids, you cannot change your own battery in one of these vehicles, it must be done at the dealer, with a BMW battery. Add another $150 for the oil change, and you’re looking at a $550-$850 bill every 10,000 miles. That is crazy exotic type of maintenance.
High end BMWs were already maintenance and repair nightmares, this is simply magnifying the problem...a lot..."
Is any of this true? What a shit deal.
High end BMWs were already maintenance and repair nightmares, this is simply magnifying the problem...a lot..."
Is any of this true? What a shit deal.
They won't let that happen. If the past is any indication of the future they'll come out with some sort of service program that addresses this for current owners and even owners of used cars. The Customer care package for the N63 that addresses it's issues covers all owners of the cars regardless of where they bought them or if they're the original owner.
They won't allow a scenario in which the customer is forced to put a battery in their car every 10k at their own expense. It just won't happen, not to mention the fact that it's not happening right now. This story is kind of wonky. Do a search for this problem on Google. I don't see it any signs of chronic battery problems. I'm on at least the five series board every day and I've never seen that mentioned.
They won't allow a scenario in which the customer is forced to put a battery in their car every 10k at their own expense. It just won't happen, not to mention the fact that it's not happening right now. This story is kind of wonky. Do a search for this problem on Google. I don't see it any signs of chronic battery problems. I'm on at least the five series board every day and I've never seen that mentioned.
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