This story requires a little explanation beforehand. The A8 is direct injected which means it has 4 fuel pumps. There are two low pressure pumps in the tank and two high pressure pumps on the engine that further raise pressure into the tens of thousands of PSI so that it can be directly injected into the combustion chamber versus a traditional low pressure setup that is injected into the intake runner before the intake valves. Because of this setup you effectively have two different fuel systems: the low pressure system which is everything between the tank and the high pressure pumps and the high pressure system which is everything between the high pressure pumps and the injectors.
So about a month ago I started getting a code for low fuel pressure on the low pressure side of the system. At the time I had no drivability issues. I called a friend who's an Audi tech and he said the pressure sensors go out all the time. Replace it and I'll be good to go. I replace it and the code comes back immediately. To further compound the situation I run the codes again and now have an accompanying low fuel pressure code for the high pressure side of the system. So now I know I have legitimate low fuel pressure and that it's likely coming from the low pressure side of the system.
I have hardly any tools out here but what I do have is one of the best Audi techs in the country. He's highly regarded and thus expensive but the alternative is me throwing more parts at the car which history has taught me generally ends up costing me more money. So I take the car in which is finally showing some drivability issues in the form of hesitation and I explain to him that I think a low pressure pump is failing. He agrees.
The next day I get a phone call from them. Both low pressure pumps are putting out low pressure. This is suspect to me. For both to fail at the same time is highly unlikely, especially considering that one only turns on above 3000 rpm and thus sees a fraction of the use as the other one but whatever. $1000 is the cost to replace them and I agree to that.
The next day I get a call that they got the pumps in but the car is still running rough. They notice my oil separator is leaking and think it's a vacuum leak from that. $350 to replace. I agree but again am suspect because before this fuel issue the car literally ran flawlessly without a hiccup. Now in the course of a few days a pump has failed and the oil separator sprung a vacuum leak large enough to affect how the engine runs despite the fact that the engine hasn't been running?
Next day I get another call, this time from the owner/ head mechanic. He tells me upon further inspection 2 of the injectors are bad but one of the low pressure pumps might still be good. With my permission he wants to put one of the original pumps back in and use that money to replace the 2 injectors. He's doing this because I told him that I was wanting to sell the car and he wanted to keep the bill close to the original price. I appreciated this.
Next day I get another call from them. This time he tells me that they've cleaned out the intake and the intake valves which were heavily caked in carbon buildup (pretty common with direct injection engines) and again with my permission he'd like to leave the oil separator in the car and instead use that money to replace all 8 injectors. He's also removed the fuel rails and had them ultrasonically cleaned. He says the separator is not leaking at an appreciable rate and the only reason they noticed it is because they did a smoke test. He says there's no downside to leaving it in and that he suggests using the money saved from that and the other low pressure pump that he's putting back and sticking that in the other injectors. He's the pro. I agree.
Now I'm pretty suspect throughout all of this because as I said, two weeks prior to this the car was running great. Now all of the sudden my injectors are all bad, my fuel rails oxidized, both of my fuel pumps are bad and then suddenly just one of my fuel pumps is bad. Seems like a lot of stuff failing at once and then fixing itself. I don't think the guys are out for a cash grab because the bill never really goes up; it just changes. Instead of buying two low pressure pumps and an oil separator I'm now buying one low pressure pump and 8 injectors. I get the call that the car is ready and at first I'm grateful. The bill is impossibly low due to the amount of parts and labor that went into it. It was something like $1500 and only $250 of that was labor. It really looked like they went out of their way to keep the bill low. I was impressed, my faith restored.
So I take the car out and not more than a block away do I get some hesitation and check engine light. I take the car back and they run the codes and get a lean mixture code. I'm suspect but the tech that was there assured me it was just clearing itself out from their intake cleaning and it would be fine.
So I get it home and guess what, it's not fine. Not only that but the check engine light is back on and both low pressure codes are back. What the fuck…Double whammy: it's running worse than it did when I brought it in.
So I call them and I explain that I'm a little peeved that the mechanic didn't take me seriously when I suggested that it might not be the intake cleaning clearing itself out. The office manager was sympathetic and offered to send a tow truck. Well hey, everyone gets one chance and they're not perfect. Also I just got a bill that showed almost no labor so I knew they ate some of that at their cost. So I told him I appreciated the offer and instead I'd use the roadside assistance with my AMEX card so they didn't need to absorb the cost of towing.
So the car goes in and initially we all agree that the other low pressure pump probably needs replacement too. When I hear back from the owner a few days later he informs me that it wasn't that but rather the passenger side high pressure pump. He's put 25 miles on it and it's running great. He's going to put another 25 - 30 miles on it just to make sure it's perfect. I'm less than enthused that I've got to replace another pump on the car and even less happy that yet another related yet completely separate component in the fuel system was replaced. It makes me question everything we've done so far as it sounds like the only thing that really needed replacement was the passenger side high pressure pump.
So he calls me the next day, says he's been running hard and it's perfect. Come get it. I assemble my bike and ride 14 miles through LA traffic to go get the car, pay the additional $600 bill and take off. I get in and at first all is well until I get to a stoplight where it feels like I'm stepping on the gas a little bit but hey, I've been driving my BMW for a week now so maybe it's in my head. Then the check engine light comes on. I mean this dude says he's put 60+ hard miles on it and no issues yet almost immediately after I take possession I have a check engine light and what feels like light surging. I get home and I have no low pressure codes (yay!) but I do have two codes for lean mixture on both banks. When it's cold it runs like a lopey cam. In other words, I suspect it has a vacuum leak that's bad when cold and as everything heats up it gets a little better. I email him and ask if we can do a smoke test Monday. He tells me to come on in.
Here's my issue though. I went to this guy because he was the best but so far from my perspective I've paid for a low pressure pump, 8 injectors and a carbon cleaning that weren't responsible for the problems the car was having. Not only that but it appears that something wasn't put back together properly as I now have a clear vacuum leak. This will be my third trip.
I'm $2300 into this problem when I theoretically only needed to be about $600 into it plus they wouldn't have removed the intake to create this vacuum leak. The only reason I'm not raging right now is because they were going above and beyond to keep the initial bill low but what good is that when literally none of the work on that initial bill was responsible for my issues? I never got the impression that it was a cash grab, just incompetence. I mean, if you're diagnosing problems properly than there's no scenario I see in which you'd say both low pressure pumps are bad, then say only one is bad and then say one of the high pressure pumps is bad. You measure fuel pressure, you see which component is not outputting the proper pressure and then bam, there's your bad component.
The problem is that while I know that they failed to properly diagnose the problem several times, I can't tell them why because I didn't do any of the work myself. Combine that with the fact that they are painfully nice and that they tried to keep that initial bill low and I'm less inclined to go in there on a rager than I otherwise would be. This kind of has me wondering if their reputation isn't built on their work but on their customer service. What would you do?
So about a month ago I started getting a code for low fuel pressure on the low pressure side of the system. At the time I had no drivability issues. I called a friend who's an Audi tech and he said the pressure sensors go out all the time. Replace it and I'll be good to go. I replace it and the code comes back immediately. To further compound the situation I run the codes again and now have an accompanying low fuel pressure code for the high pressure side of the system. So now I know I have legitimate low fuel pressure and that it's likely coming from the low pressure side of the system.
I have hardly any tools out here but what I do have is one of the best Audi techs in the country. He's highly regarded and thus expensive but the alternative is me throwing more parts at the car which history has taught me generally ends up costing me more money. So I take the car in which is finally showing some drivability issues in the form of hesitation and I explain to him that I think a low pressure pump is failing. He agrees.
The next day I get a phone call from them. Both low pressure pumps are putting out low pressure. This is suspect to me. For both to fail at the same time is highly unlikely, especially considering that one only turns on above 3000 rpm and thus sees a fraction of the use as the other one but whatever. $1000 is the cost to replace them and I agree to that.
The next day I get a call that they got the pumps in but the car is still running rough. They notice my oil separator is leaking and think it's a vacuum leak from that. $350 to replace. I agree but again am suspect because before this fuel issue the car literally ran flawlessly without a hiccup. Now in the course of a few days a pump has failed and the oil separator sprung a vacuum leak large enough to affect how the engine runs despite the fact that the engine hasn't been running?
Next day I get another call, this time from the owner/ head mechanic. He tells me upon further inspection 2 of the injectors are bad but one of the low pressure pumps might still be good. With my permission he wants to put one of the original pumps back in and use that money to replace the 2 injectors. He's doing this because I told him that I was wanting to sell the car and he wanted to keep the bill close to the original price. I appreciated this.
Next day I get another call from them. This time he tells me that they've cleaned out the intake and the intake valves which were heavily caked in carbon buildup (pretty common with direct injection engines) and again with my permission he'd like to leave the oil separator in the car and instead use that money to replace all 8 injectors. He's also removed the fuel rails and had them ultrasonically cleaned. He says the separator is not leaking at an appreciable rate and the only reason they noticed it is because they did a smoke test. He says there's no downside to leaving it in and that he suggests using the money saved from that and the other low pressure pump that he's putting back and sticking that in the other injectors. He's the pro. I agree.
Now I'm pretty suspect throughout all of this because as I said, two weeks prior to this the car was running great. Now all of the sudden my injectors are all bad, my fuel rails oxidized, both of my fuel pumps are bad and then suddenly just one of my fuel pumps is bad. Seems like a lot of stuff failing at once and then fixing itself. I don't think the guys are out for a cash grab because the bill never really goes up; it just changes. Instead of buying two low pressure pumps and an oil separator I'm now buying one low pressure pump and 8 injectors. I get the call that the car is ready and at first I'm grateful. The bill is impossibly low due to the amount of parts and labor that went into it. It was something like $1500 and only $250 of that was labor. It really looked like they went out of their way to keep the bill low. I was impressed, my faith restored.
So I take the car out and not more than a block away do I get some hesitation and check engine light. I take the car back and they run the codes and get a lean mixture code. I'm suspect but the tech that was there assured me it was just clearing itself out from their intake cleaning and it would be fine.
So I get it home and guess what, it's not fine. Not only that but the check engine light is back on and both low pressure codes are back. What the fuck…Double whammy: it's running worse than it did when I brought it in.
So I call them and I explain that I'm a little peeved that the mechanic didn't take me seriously when I suggested that it might not be the intake cleaning clearing itself out. The office manager was sympathetic and offered to send a tow truck. Well hey, everyone gets one chance and they're not perfect. Also I just got a bill that showed almost no labor so I knew they ate some of that at their cost. So I told him I appreciated the offer and instead I'd use the roadside assistance with my AMEX card so they didn't need to absorb the cost of towing.
So the car goes in and initially we all agree that the other low pressure pump probably needs replacement too. When I hear back from the owner a few days later he informs me that it wasn't that but rather the passenger side high pressure pump. He's put 25 miles on it and it's running great. He's going to put another 25 - 30 miles on it just to make sure it's perfect. I'm less than enthused that I've got to replace another pump on the car and even less happy that yet another related yet completely separate component in the fuel system was replaced. It makes me question everything we've done so far as it sounds like the only thing that really needed replacement was the passenger side high pressure pump.
So he calls me the next day, says he's been running hard and it's perfect. Come get it. I assemble my bike and ride 14 miles through LA traffic to go get the car, pay the additional $600 bill and take off. I get in and at first all is well until I get to a stoplight where it feels like I'm stepping on the gas a little bit but hey, I've been driving my BMW for a week now so maybe it's in my head. Then the check engine light comes on. I mean this dude says he's put 60+ hard miles on it and no issues yet almost immediately after I take possession I have a check engine light and what feels like light surging. I get home and I have no low pressure codes (yay!) but I do have two codes for lean mixture on both banks. When it's cold it runs like a lopey cam. In other words, I suspect it has a vacuum leak that's bad when cold and as everything heats up it gets a little better. I email him and ask if we can do a smoke test Monday. He tells me to come on in.
Here's my issue though. I went to this guy because he was the best but so far from my perspective I've paid for a low pressure pump, 8 injectors and a carbon cleaning that weren't responsible for the problems the car was having. Not only that but it appears that something wasn't put back together properly as I now have a clear vacuum leak. This will be my third trip.
I'm $2300 into this problem when I theoretically only needed to be about $600 into it plus they wouldn't have removed the intake to create this vacuum leak. The only reason I'm not raging right now is because they were going above and beyond to keep the initial bill low but what good is that when literally none of the work on that initial bill was responsible for my issues? I never got the impression that it was a cash grab, just incompetence. I mean, if you're diagnosing problems properly than there's no scenario I see in which you'd say both low pressure pumps are bad, then say only one is bad and then say one of the high pressure pumps is bad. You measure fuel pressure, you see which component is not outputting the proper pressure and then bam, there's your bad component.
The problem is that while I know that they failed to properly diagnose the problem several times, I can't tell them why because I didn't do any of the work myself. Combine that with the fact that they are painfully nice and that they tried to keep that initial bill low and I'm less inclined to go in there on a rager than I otherwise would be. This kind of has me wondering if their reputation isn't built on their work but on their customer service. What would you do?
