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Old 10-04-2017, 01:42 PM   #76
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My bad, thought the Volt was a full EV vehicle.
2017 Bolt EV: All-Electric Vehicle | Chevrolet
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:43 PM   #77
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I was just looking that up, quess I had the bolt and volt mixed up.
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:50 PM   #78
 
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I guess that depends on the company, I have a client that is around 150 users and have 10 charging spots for their employees now. Knowing my client even if their workforce was fully EV they won't ever charge the employee's. They do this as a added benefit of working for them instead of the competitors.



Now there will be cheapass companies or should I say employers who think consumables such as fuel or electricity is the employee's responsibility and will charge for it. I agree with this mindset as it's been the standard for any employee/employer. However culture changes and what's acceptable today is not the same as what was acceptable yesterday. In 10-15 years who knows what would be considered acceptable.


There is also the “fairness” aspect to it as well. I have had people in past jobs ask why they cannot get fuel money for gasoline from work since I’m basically getting the same thing via electric, just because I chose a electric car.

That will become an issue HR departments will face, as some will view it as favoritism
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Old 10-04-2017, 01:52 PM   #79
 
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I was just looking that up, quess I had the bolt and volt mixed up.


Common mistake, and quite frankly if you say either name fast in a conversation they sound nearly the same. Can’t tell you how many people thought I had a “bolt” when I actually said volt. Lol
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Old 10-04-2017, 02:59 PM   #80
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Too small. Karma is doing that with the Revero (old Fisker Karma) and you get something like 3 miles of range PER DAY off the solar panel in a sunny environment and you'll have to have your $130,000 car sitting in the sun all day to achieve that. They're just not efficient enough to have any real practical use yet.
why the shit did they even bother with this?

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So here's headlines not from this year, not from this month but just from today...

Ford to shift one-third of internal combustion engine investments to electric cars

Toshiba claims its new electric car battery enables 200 miles of range with a 6-minute charge

I've discussed certain technologies with a really successful business friend of mine and neither of us can wrap our heads around why there are still so many people refusing to believe that the industry is shifting and why they continue to deny it even as the changes get more and more obvious. We were saying these things a couple years ago before you had daily headlines about faster charging and manufacturers like Volvo announcing a major shift to electrification and a complete halt in diesel investment. Even companies like Porsche that insisted an electric car could never be made with their badge because they couldn't make it perform like a Porsche, is setting sites directly on Tesla with ultra high speed 350kw charging and a performance sedan to be released soon.

And in the face of these changes the naysayers are largely unwavering in their doubt, unwilling to concede that they might be wrong at all and in many cases doubling down on how unlikely the shift is, spouting the same tired old limitations in the technology that have largely been solved and are trickling down to cheaper cars at an ever increasing rate. This isn't aimed you Mike. It's an interesting look into how people have access to the same information and can walk away with completely different opinions.
i'm just looking at history and economics, which don't make the full EV the slam dunk 95% thing as you perceive it to be. of course EVs have advantage in this or that use case, and of course if you spend fat dollars you can get some fat performance. the use case i am looking at are the vast majority of cars people actually buy in the middle. the EV that can stand alone without political subsidy, offers a competitive price and package vs. class peers, is sold profitably, and doesn't offer any compromise to having to live life around it's chargers vs. ice/ice hybrid offering the ability to do whatever/whenever you want. you say that day is here, or definitely tomorrow, i'm not skeptical that it's day will come, i just think it is a lot further off.

part of me is skeptical in how that day will come, ie. will we buy cars the same as now and my up to 50 or your up to 95% EV happens? or will we simply not buy/own a car at all, because we can just uber up a self driving EV car, with no worry about charge time because like k1 they just keep a larger fleet to sustain availability, and manage it better than some kids so there's never an unforseen break.

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So one big point Mike K is using in his argument is that charging is free. Today that is partially true, you pay for charging at your home, some work places don't charge you and put up charging stations. Tesla's supercharging stations are free.

Do you really believe that if the market goes to 30+% EV vs. ICE that it will remain free? I don't think so, I do think that the current gas stations will add more electric stations but start charging at some point. Work places will most likely continue to provide charging stations at no charge (consider it a part of their comp or benefit package). If some of the other manufacturer's start putting in their own charging network I very seriously doubt it will be at no cost. It may be built into the price of the car, it may be a monthly service fee or like traditionally pay per use.

Tesla is only doing it to help get their product in the market place, The big 3 and foreign automakers aren't going to let their profits dwindle due to increased cost of supplying a consumable.

I do think Mike K is right on some things, I do think the EV vs ICE will be above the 50% market share in the next 10-15 years. In 30 it may be 90-95%. I don't see any Diesel loosing it's market share to EV.
it is certainly a good point that charging is unlikely to stay this cheap, and neither are taxes for the road when they are levied unfairly only against gasoline.

i care less personally about the cost to refuel than the time it takes to do so, i don't want to spend any more time than i already do at a gas station or worrying about whether i have enough charge/gas to do x/y/z. i can always plug my cell phone in everywhere too, that doesn't mean the charging is convenient, and most of us have grown up without having to live around managing a car like this. meanwhile a serial or parallel ICE hybrid has the advantages of being an EV most of the time, but the advantages of an ICE if i need it. mike k, didn't you get the i3 with a range extender? wouldn't it have been cheaper to get one without?

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Interactive Tesla Supercharger Map

Check that out, zoom out after clicking

and read this: https://www.tesla.com/supercharger
this site would be a lot cooler if you said i'm going from chicago to san francisco and it showed you the route to take. am i missing something or does it only show locations and leave you to do the work?

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Most EV cars have a range of 240-300 ish miles. If your really doing long trips you'll need to charge sometime through out the day. With the link Emerson provided if you have a Tesla you can supercharge the car in and around 30+ mins and get a good amount of range in that time. Figure stopping for lunch it's not too much of a hindrance.

I don't know about say a Volt or other fully EV car if it can accept Tesla's supercharging and if it can how quickly it can bring it to full charge.
note the car is going to get less of course if you're womping on that acceleration. or if it's winter and you've got the heat on or summer and you're using the air conditioning. these are reasons why full EV is less great for cars but fantastic for motorcycles.
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Old 10-04-2017, 03:01 PM   #81
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The Tesla GPS does that for you
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Old 10-05-2017, 02:17 AM   #82
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Instead of using electric motors to assist gas they should use gas to assist electrics cars. Put a Honda ruckus motor in the car to run the accessories
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Old 10-05-2017, 06:49 AM   #83
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Instead of using electric motors to assist gas they should use gas to assist electrics cars. Put a Honda ruckus motor in the car to run the accessories
Um current hybrids work like that....gas assists the electric motor.
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Old 10-05-2017, 07:08 AM   #84
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Um current hybrids work like that....gas assists the electric motor.
Just the volt and the I3 unless I missed some. My fusion is setup like a hybrid with a 20 mile battery I can choose to run.
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Old 10-05-2017, 11:34 AM   #85
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Um current hybrids work like that....gas assists the electric motor.
But gas is the reliant motor, most have batteries that can only run 20-30miles. Let's swap it... Battery is main power source, Honda ruckus motor does accessory shit
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Old 10-05-2017, 01:22 PM   #86
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Just the volt and the I3 unless I missed some. My fusion is setup like a hybrid with a 20 mile battery I can choose to run.
interesting

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But gas is the reliant motor, most have batteries that can only run 20-30miles. Let's swap it... Battery is main power source, Honda ruckus motor does accessory shit
that is how it should work. its silly to have the batteries be used only or 20-30 miles and then it switches to gas. I agree electric motor should be main and gas just there to charge the bitch. Thats what I thought a hybrid was.
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