What to do? Problems with my 12 year old daugher.

[CuzzinOlaf]

I'm coming to my wits end and need some new ideas. My 12 year old daughter has a problem with lying and I'm running out of ideas on dealing with her. Her lying problem is getting out of hand and this past Friday, she stole a water bottle from another kid at school, lied when confronted, and got busted by the principal because there are cameras everywhere at the school.

A little background.

1. She's my step daughter and I've only been in her life for the last 4 years or so. She's a full time project between her school work and behavior.

2. Her dad is worthless (in life and parenting) and her grandmother has no idea how to raise kids. They go visit "grandma" every other weekend and he lives with his parents who also pay his child support. He knew about what she did and didn't say a word and played video games in his room all weekend. Grandma did nothing about this either.

3. I've tried everything from grounding her, taking things away, having her write me essays on why lying is bad, etc. and none of it has worked.

4. I've threatened her with having her move in with her "grandma" as she hates going there. We know this isn't a good idea but I figured maybe it would work.....

5. I told her she won't be getting any Christmas gifts from me if she continues with this crap and then this happened.

I'm sure that I'm leaving out a lot of things I've tried. I listed out the things I've done to punish her but also want to mention I've tried the exact opposite in the past. We did a reward based system and she's get anything from candy, to toys, to nicer things if she could "do the right things" and it didn't work.

HELP!!

Click to read more...

 

[blakbearddelite]

Have you tried escalating the times things are taken away from her? We used to ground my son for TV/iPad for a day. If he was being uncooperative, and we were threatening to take something away, I could see him thinking it over in his head. I could see him thinking, ‘It’s only one day’, that’s no big deal. So for every repeat offense, we started adding a day. When he started losing the iPad for four days because he misbehaved, he started thinking it wasn’t worth it anymore.

But it sounds like your scenario is a little more complicated as there are other factors present with the dead-beat dad and poor co-parenting.

 

[Great White Drake]

Start lying to her. Let her know how shitty it feels first hand.

 

[10sec]

I'm not sure what suggestions are going to pop up in here, but if you got a kid that doesn't respect you, they're never going to listen to anything you say.

 

[Mook]

We've got a lot of parents on here. Should be of some help.
[MENTION=340]Eagle[/MENTION] has 3 daughters.

 

[CuzzinOlaf]

Have you tried escalating the times things are taken away from her? We used to ground my son for TV/iPad for a day. If he was being uncooperative, and we were threatening to take something away, I could see him thinking it over in his head. I could see him thinking, ‘It’s only one day’, that’s no big deal. So for every repeat offense, we started adding a day. When he started losing the iPad for four days because he misbehaved, he started thinking it wasn’t worth it anymore.

But it sounds like your scenario is a little more complicated as there are other factors present with the dead-beat dad and poor co-parenting.

Her grandmother is bad, her mom is on the same page as I am. She hasn't had her iPad or any electronic gadgets in weeks already.

Start lying to her. Let her know how shitty it feels first hand.

Ha, I thought about that but then I'm not setting a good example.

I'm not sure what suggestions are going to pop up in here, but if you got a kid that doesn't respect you, they're never going to listen to anything you say.

It isn't just me though, it seems to be everyone. She lied to her friend at school and said she didn't steal the water bottle when she did.

Funny thing is she loves me to death. Always wants to do things with me, go to the store with me, help with anything I'm doing, etc. It really is a problem with lying and listening.

 

[Mr_Roboto]

The lack of consistency she is getting is hurting your efforts. Document what is happening, and make sure they are aware there are problems and you need their help in resolving them. If you ever get to a point where there are hearings around custody, being able to prove you have done your due diligence may give you leverage.

My advice is go talk to the school, bring the wife with you (not the daughter.) At the very least make sure they know that you're trying to work through it. Try to figure out how to bring in as much consistency as you can. That will be what wins the day. That's a rough time in one's life based on my experiences, just keep trying to get the message in and be consistent in doing such. Also, let her fall and make her own mistakes. Some people try to make their kids able to live in a world of minimal consequence. I disagree with that in virtually all cases.

Ultimately we can only make minimal changes in the path we can't determine the course. That is their decision ultimately.

 

[Great White Drake]

I mean don't stick to it lmao. Get her excited about something (concert tickets to her favorite band) then tell her you made it up. Don't make it a joke or mean spirited. She has to understand you did this out of love. Make it a teachable moment.

Also important is to make sure you never lie to others in front of her. You could even set up a fake scenario where telling the truth to someone would harm you but you do it anyway. And let it all play out in front of her so she realizes consequences of telling the truth aren't so bad.

 

[CuzzinOlaf]

The lack of consistency she is getting is hurting your efforts. Document what is happening, and make sure they are aware there are problems and you need their help in resolving them. If you ever get to a point where there are hearings around custody, being able to prove you have done your due diligence may give you leverage.

My advice is go talk to the school, bring the wife with you (not the daughter.) At the very least make sure they know that you're trying to work through it. Try to figure out how to bring in as much consistency as you can. That will be what wins the day. That's a rough time in one's life based on my experiences, just keep trying to get the message in and be consistent in doing such. Also, let her fall and make her own mistakes. Some people try to make their kids able to live in a world of minimal consequence. I disagree with that in virtually all cases.

Ultimately we can only make minimal changes in the path we can't determine the course. That is their decision ultimately.

I refused to talk to her dad for several years and finally did this summer. He says he agrees with us and then does nothing. My worry is she's going to end up just like him. I'm done talking to him after this situation and am half tempted to call him and voice my opinion. I won't because it won't get me anywhere.

I will contact the school to see if I can set something up. It might have to be over the phone because of her work schedule but at least it is something.

Letting her fail how? I try to stay on top of her about her school work and this lying thing. I get what you're saying but give me an example.

 

[CuzzinOlaf]

I mean don't stick to it lmao. Get her excited about something (concert tickets to her favorite band) then tell her you made it up. Don't make it a joke or mean spirited. She has to understand you did this out of love. Make it a teachable moment.

Also important is to make sure you never lie to others in front of her. You could even set up a fake scenario where telling the truth to someone would harm you but you do it anyway. And let it all play out in front of her so she realizes consequences of telling the truth aren't so bad.

I guess her dad's false promises means he loves her LMAO. I know what you mean and could try that... but if she keeps this crap up she'll be grounded forever.

 

[boostedguy05]

show her how dissapointed in her you are, and tell you how you know she can be better. sometimes knowing a dissapointed parent is a lot worse than a mad parent.

 

[Lord Tin Foilhat]

Just beat her every time she lies.

 

[Eagle]

You've got a tough situation on your hands here as there's likely quite a few levels of issues you'll need to work through to fix all this, IMO. Warning, this is gonna get deep.

First, you say "my daughter" - is she adopted after you married her mom? Is that all official, paperwork and all? How is her Mom at parenting her when she's acting out? Does she respect you as her Dad? That might seem like a loaded question, but understand I don't mean it in a way that she doesn't give you shit, have attitude towards you or whatever, but I mean more like does she understand you're her Dad and believe that you've got her back?

Next, what kind of kid is she? Does she work hard at school and get as good a grade as you could expect her to achieve when giving it her honest best? What kinds of friends does she hold and are those kids good influences? Lots of times, kids will do stupid shit to impress "friends" that aren't really friends at all. Important to teach kids, especially around 12yrs old what a "real friend" is - even if it means they have only a few friends.

Lastly... toughest of all... you have to be open and honest with your kids in situations like these. You have to explain to them how the "successful world" views the negative actions they might be taking and paint a picture of how they might end up if they continue down the path they're on. Punishment (like grounding or taking toys away) doesn't really work well to guide children past a certain age. I found with my kids that they changed more when we spoke to them like young adults, like you would have to talk to a peer more than a child - know what I mean? I think kids respond better to mutual respect than they do threats and consequences - but this is something you might have to work up to in some cases... respect is certainly key though.

Be warned though, for me, these conversations with my kids whenever they get into problems might take HOURS of sitting down and talking to them - and getting them to talk - to figure out why they did what they did, what they were thinking about when they did it, getting them to figure out why they shouldn't do it again, and getting them to understand that (in the case of stealing) that Mom and Dad will always provide for them whatever they need and that there is NO REASON to steal from someone when you can simply ask for whatever they might want.

Not sure I helped... but kids take lots of time and talking to. But they're your kid(s), so its a worthwhile investment.

PS - if you (or your wife in this case) don't have full custody (IE: not 50/50) from a deadbeat Dad who lives with his parents, you probably have some lawyer time you'll need to spend too.

 

[Great White Drake]

I guess her dad's false promises means he loves her LMAO. I know what you mean and could try that... but if she keeps this crap up she'll be grounded forever.

There it is....The idea of being held accountable for lies is something she's not willing to confront her dad with. She doesn't want to deal with that pain so she participates n it to normalize it. Jmo

 

[SMKE EM]

Threaten her with military school then force her to watch some videos with you.

If she keeps up the behavior, take her to her new home.

 

[CMNTMXR57]

Where is your Wife in all this? Am I to take it that she is the biological Mother?

The issue you are running in to is that she doesn't take you seriously because you AREN'T her biological father. This is why I ask about the Wife. Both of you need to be on the same page and consistent in whatever route you take.

Lying to her as previously mentioned, won't work and may actually create distrust and more angst in her than trying to solve for the current issues.

I would start looking down the risk/reward line of thought. "Oh, you wanted to go to..."insertconcertorlocationoreventhere". Well, people who lie don't get to go to that! "Oh, that new iphoneXX you want? Sorry, when you steal and lie, iphoneXX's don't end up under the tree... Sorry!"

I'm not saying that you barter with them, but they need to learn consequence. When they do something wrong, there is consequence, be that punishment or rewards being taken away... and if you or the wife don't follow through consistently (mentioned previously), they (she) basically laughs at you.

 

[Flyn]

I have two daughters, one finishing up her RN nursing college at FGCU, the other getting her Master's in Genetic Counseling. VERY proud of them but they weren't always the easiest people to live with. I went so far as to dump all my older daughter's clothes and items in my backyard when she kept refusing to clean her room. I told her I would do it after lesser attempts failed and gave her a date - clean your room by X/X/X or the stuff ends up in the backyard. She didn't so I did. She was VERY stubborn but has matured into a tremendous young adult.

Girls are more complex than boys. They have issues that are harder for guys to understand. As always, a combination of carrot and stick along with a lot of talking and love will work.

Hate to say it but the answer usually takes years. There's is no quick fix.

Talk with her often to let her see you are interested in her life. Be honest! She may be getting the lying from observed behaviors? Mutually set goals that can be accomplished. If you can get these in writing and have her sign them, that's helpful. Make some small goals and REWARD her when she accomplishes a goal. Be understanding but firm with punishment when she doesn't. Say I love you often. Keep this up consistently until she grows up and amazes you by turning into a wonderful adult. Good luck!

 

[CuzzinOlaf]

You've got a tough situation on your hands here as there's likely quite a few levels of issues you'll need to work through to fix all this, IMO. Warning, this is gonna get deep.

First, you say "my daughter" - is she adopted after you married her mom? Is that all official, paperwork and all? How is her Mom at parenting her when she's acting out? Does she respect you as her Dad? That might seem like a loaded question, but understand I don't mean it in a way that she doesn't give you shit, have attitude towards you or whatever, but I mean more like does she understand you're her Dad and believe that you've got her back?

Next, what kind of kid is she? Does she work hard at school and get as good a grade as you could expect her to achieve when giving it her honest best? What kinds of friends does she hold and are those kids good influences? Lots of times, kids will do stupid shit to impress "friends" that aren't really friends at all. Important to teach kids, especially around 12yrs old what a "real friend" is - even if it means they have only a few friends.

Lastly... toughest of all... you have to be open and honest with your kids in situations like these. You have to explain to them how the "successful world" views the negative actions they might be taking and paint a picture of how they might end up if they continue down the path they're on. Punishment (like grounding or taking toys away) doesn't really work well to guide children past a certain age. I found with my kids that they changed more when we spoke to them like young adults, like you would have to talk to a peer more than a child - know what I mean? I think kids respond better to mutual respect than they do threats and consequences - but this is something you might have to work up to in some cases... respect is certainly key though.

Be warned though, for me, these conversations with my kids whenever they get into problems might take HOURS of sitting down and talking to them - and getting them to talk - to figure out why they did what they did, what they were thinking about when they did it, getting them to figure out why they shouldn't do it again, and getting them to understand that (in the case of stealing) that Mom and Dad will always provide for them whatever they need and that there is NO REASON to steal from someone when you can simply ask for whatever they might want.

Not sure I helped... but kids take lots of time and talking to. But they're your kid(s), so its a worthwhile investment.

PS - if you (or your wife in this case) don't have full custody (IE: not 50/50) from a deadbeat Dad who lives with his parents, you probably have some lawyer time you'll need to spend too.

I say my daughter because I look at her as my own. I have not adopted her but would; not sure how that would go. I know the dad signed off on his rights and that he has visitation (grandma has visitation in reality) and haven’t talked to a lawyer about this. He mom and I are very similar on our parenting and values. I tend to be the more lenient of the two of us when it comes to certain things but we pretty much agree on everything. I will say I have higher expectations and am stricter when it comes to taking things away and with punishments.

She respects me minus the lying part and the occasional not listening part. She listens to me more than she listens to her mom. I would like to think she knows I have her back. She comes to me for help with her homework and stuff like that. We’ve had at length talks about various things and how the real world works. I’ve tried to talk to her as an adult even and to let her know I want her to be successful in life.

She isn’t the greatest student to be honest. The first few years were tough getting her to do her homework on time, to apply herself more, etc. If it is something with crafts or art, she’ll excel without a doubt. She like cooking shows, craft type stuff, and wants to go back to gymnastics. The problem I see is that she never gives anything her all. Even her teachers at conferences last month said she needs to put in more of an effort. I will add this is the first week at her new school (we just moved from Round Lake to Spring Grove) and I told her this isn’t the way you start off making new friends.

The toughest is the easiest for me to do. I’ve explained how things are in the real world and how lying, stealing, and not doing your best can negatively impact her future. She realizes what her real dad is about and has even related things I’m talking about to him or his scenario. I know things about her dad as well and without talking about him, related several instances of things she’s done to his real life. I keep saying if you want to have lots of friends, nice things, a house, all the pets you can imagine (she loves animals) and have a happy life you need to change your ways. I talk to her like a young adult and treat her as if she was my own. We’ve had lengthy conversations already and I can tell she’s getting bored, lots of nodding, and yessing and her saying she knows.

She does have full custody. I don’t know to what level but she didn’t need his authorization when getting a passport or to take them out of the country.

 

[CuzzinOlaf]

Threaten her with military school then force her to watch some videos with you.

If she keeps up the behavior, take her to her new home.

Ha, I mentioned that already LOL. I should find some Youtube videos to show her.

Where is your Wife in all this? Am I to take it that she is the biological Mother?

The issue you are running in to is that she doesn't take you seriously because you AREN'T her biological father. This is why I ask about the Wife. Both of you need to be on the same page and consistent in whatever route you take.

Lying to her as previously mentioned, won't work and may actually create distrust and more angst in her than trying to solve for the current issues.

I would start looking down the risk/reward line of thought. "Oh, you wanted to go to..."insertconcertorlocationoreventhere". Well, people who lie don't get to go to that! "Oh, that new iphoneXX you want? Sorry, when you steal and lie, iphoneXX's don't end up under the tree... Sorry!"

I'm not saying that you barter with them, but they need to learn consequence. When they do something wrong, there is consequence, be that punishment or rewards being taken away... and if you or the wife don't follow through consistently (mentioned previously), they (she) basically laughs at you.

She's around and has been trying just as much. We're both very consistent and Haley has no idea how a biological father should be. I've done more with her in the last four years then her dad has done in his entire life, it really is sad. Example, he wanted her for Father's Day because he thinks that is what he's supposed to do. She begged me not to make her go there. They ended up going and he didn't do jack shit.

I'm huge on consequences and rewarding them for good behavior. She's been rewarded plenty for good behavior and I'm very strict when rules are broken. She knows more about consequences than most kids I'd like to think. Hell, my nickname is drill sergeant (probably because I was in the Army) because of how I operate. Not in the mean way, but in the way I am about rules.

Talk with her often to let her see you are interested in her life. Be honest! She may be getting the lying from observed behaviors? Mutually set goals that can be accomplished. If you can get these in writing and have her sign them, that's helpful. Make some small goals and REWARD her when she accomplishes a goal. Be understanding but firm with punishment when she doesn't. Say I love you often. Keep this up consistently until she grows up and amazes you by turning into a wonderful adult. Good luck!

Thank you, great advice and much of what I have already tried. I'll try again to have a heart to heart with her again this week. I really do want the best for her.

 

[MuffHugger]

Have you tried turning it off then back on again?

 

[SMKE EM]

Ha, I mentioned that already LOL. I should find some Youtube videos to show her.



She's around and has been trying just as much. We're both very consistent and Haley has no idea how a biological father should be. I've done more with her in the last four years then her dad has done in his entire life, it really is sad. Example, he wanted her for Father's Day because he thinks that is what he's supposed to do. She begged me not to make her go there. They ended up going and he didn't do jack shit.

I'm huge on consequences and rewarding them for good behavior. She's been rewarded plenty for good behavior and I'm very strict when rules are broken. She knows more about consequences than most kids I'd like to think. Hell, my nickname is drill sergeant (probably because I was in the Army) because of how I operate. Not in the mean way, but in the way I am about rules.




Thank you, great advice and much of what I have already tried. I'll try again to have a heart to heart with her again this week. I really do want the best for her.

Kids need to be shown with video of real life day to day inside. It scares most kids straight honestly.

Get her mom to sit down with you and seem very serious. Your daughter will start thinking of how badly that will suck and have no friends being yelled at every day living off someone elses strict time schedule with no freedom.

 

[Blood on Blood]

I have 3 daughters and the advice members are providing you is sound.

 

[RICH17]

i remember my sister being the worst when she first got her period. maybe thats happening?

 

[HeavyG]

first of all, dont listen to people on here without kids...

2nd, talk to a family counselor.

 

[willizm]

As someone that has experience with behavioral problems with a kid that’s lives between two houses the biggest problem I see is point 2. You need to have consistency between both households or else the enabling behavior of the one house becomes a sort of haven for her to retreat to. Any time you try to enact stricter behavior she is going to default to that environment where she isn’t accountable for actions.

My recommendation is to work with the grandparents and the dad to say none of this works without them being on board.

My son was pulling similar behavioral problems and now I got the Mom to be on board so that we enact the same disapproval and punishment between both house holds. Basically that shit don’t fly in either house holds. It has helped emensly.